Mystletein

bf 109 E1

100 posts in this topic

Probably bad, although I generally use 7.7mm MGs on my A6-based fighters when Im spraying a long range (I use the cannons and MGs seperately) and only use the cannons when im reasonably sure to hit. But even with the 7.7mm MGs I occasionally score enough hits on a plane to take it down even without having to use 20mm cannons, so this thing might still be able to do stuff in battles. Also the MGs are better suited for ground attack than cannons due to their ammo load. 

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It's probably better in historical where a little damage can already lead to a crash....

 

But in arcade it is a piece of shiiet imho. Four rifle-calibre machine guns just don't cut it against T7 planes against you are often matched. Heck I pumped a full belt into an mig3 yesterday, had to trail him for 2 minutes before he went down.

 

In short, it is in every regard worse than the MC202 at T4.......and this plane was already notorious for it's low firepower.

 

Heck, this thing has lower firepower than russian RESERVE PLANES.........now I don't really care since I am long past T5 but this thing should be at T2-3 fighting Hurricanes and Spit I, imho.

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Nope, the E-1 is actually very good, can turn fight with the best. Admittedly it does take longer to get a kill, BUT I feel it performs better than the E-3 with those utterly useless cannons.

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Yes wrong spot in the tree for it... should fight early spits and I-16 if we go historical... I still think when all the Bf-109 versions come in game tiering will be readjusted and be both more fair and more historical

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E1 is useless in Tier 5 or 4.

I dont know why a lagg3 is in tier3 (with 20mm and 12,7mm cannon) , but the E1 is in Tier5 :dntknw:

Laggs cant climb, cant turn, they're ugly, they're laggs. Thats why.

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Laggs cant climb, cant turn, they're ugly, they're laggs. Thats why.

 

But the have way more firepower, and i get far more kills with it, even in tier 4-5

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thread was about the Bf 109, not about Lagg's, keep on topic, but anyway, this new 109 is not bad at all.....so far

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It was important to get another fighter for Germany at tier 4 - 5 to send the much more crappier Italian planes of tier 3 (CR.40/42) to holidays (if you want to focus on fighters not bombers in your rooster).

 

 

Talking about Its performance or its tier ...I am not going to bash the Russian planes (this time), too obvious...  :Ps

There is a similar discussion somewhere else in this forum (battle of Britain event) about tiering and I want to introduce the Hurricane MK IIb as an example in comparison.

Yes, the Hurricane is - and was - the better plane than the BF 109 E-1 for a very simple reason: The MK II b was released almost two years later than the BF 109 E-1 in 1941! (The E-1 in 1939)
The question shouldn't be about why the BF 109 is tier 5 - which basically would be ok - , but why a superior plane like the Hurricane MK IIb - that saw service almost two years later - is on a lower tier than the BF 109...

By what standard Gaijin tiers planes? Historically? Performance-dependent? The Hurricane MK IIb is not a tier 3 plane by by either standard (and it's by far not the only example).

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[...]

By what standard Gaijin tiers planes? Historically? Performance-dependent? The Hurricane MK IIb is not a tier 3 plane by by either standard (and it's by far not the only example).

 

IMHO roughly by gunpower - with special exempt for Russian supremacy and commiserating exceptions for poor Imperial Origami Samurai Airforce...

 

0-1 ---  7-8mm +a few first .50cals

2-3 --- many 7-8mm and/or .50cals, but s.a.

4-5 --- weaker 20mm cannons (i.e. low RoF, great scatter,...) or better .50cals

6-7 --- stronger 20mm or even more .50cals, and/or first 37mm also higher plane speed.

8-9 --- better flight characteristics, higher speed, all armaments

10+ --- ranking according to flight performance in focus, some ranking along the "more 20mm cannons - higher rank)

17+ --- jets

 

Basic (observable) rules for single fighters. Heavies get access to bigger punches earlier. Russians too.

 

Historical? LOL. Rank 3 LaGG: first flight january 1941. Bf 109 E First flight 1937, first combat use 1938 in spain, German service introduction early 1939...

Edited by suicidal_godot
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I flew it in 1 mission and played carefully with BnZ tactics. Didnt work all that well for that ended up getting 4 kill assists and 2 kills by pecking away. Even while zoomed on wings of spitfires it took awhile to down them. Possible hit detection issues?? I see rounds bouncing off the wings but getting no credit for hits. Anyway, the big plus is how it turns. Combat flaps in a dive can stay right with a spitfire for the most part, although not how I would generally fly a 109, it works with this one. I will keep playing and get it unlocked before I give it more thought. 

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Hey My Typhoon has .30 cals and its in tier seven last I looked . Ok so its LOTS of .30 cals ..but still when I check other tier fives I see..ummmm your RIGHT it sucks ..lol..where the other fighters with only .30 ??

 

 You sure they didn't sneak a 20 mm in the nose like it HAD  ? and used the .30 to adjust aim for cannon as was done ?

 

 

 

 Huge point not to be overlooked .

 


Historical? LOL. Rank 3 LaGG: first flight january 1941. Bf 109 E First flight 1937, first combat use 1938 in spain, German service introduction early 1939...

 

 But why bother balance a tier when you use MM to bork it up by mixing Bi-planes and early Fighters against said Lagg and worse ?

 

 The tiers make little sense ok . I will accept that .

 But MM makes even less , G50 vs Aircobra is always a laugh.

Edited by ledhed14
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30 cal of british is different from German

 

If you see the Bullet Projectile

 

Well Majority want this plane at Tier 2-3

 

Hope Devs may consider

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A little Bit over Tiered... Compare to Tier tier 4 with 20mm FFF cannon O_O

 

 

Depends what your reference setting is ... and if you tier by historical commissioning or performance or a mix of both.

 

I compare to the 'meridian' BF 109 E-3 which was in service in late 1939 at the start of the war. It is tier 6 so earlier birds should be lower tiers, later planes higher tiers, then comes some finetuning if the plane was particularly capable (or not, like the Italian birds...) and increase or decrease the final tier. Based on the chronology within Germany tier 5 for the 109 E-1 is fine.

 

The problem is the comparison to other countries: The Spitfire MK IIs saw service in late 1940 - 1 year after the BF 109 E-3 - yet it is tier 5 & 6 instead of tier 7 & 8 ... I guess no-one doubts that it is a capable plane, so why has the Spitfire MK II such a low tier?

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109E is not an BnZ Fighter. 109E and F are energyfighters.

And the E1 works very good. Just played today and allready got 7 kills with it. 4 in one match, 3 in an other. 3 of that kills where bombers. They took a little bit longer. But after the first seconds they where mostly out of action (killed gunners, damaged flaps).

And i can kill fighters with it in one or two burst, like i did with a hurri today. The other fighters didn't took that much more. The guns fire way faster then the 7mm of the brits. Atm you will do the same damage as 6 brownings I think. It should  like 9 afaik (500 bpm for the spit brownings, 1080bpm for the MG17).

 

For the tiering

 

Axis = Tier +2

Allis = Tier +/-0 (mostly)
mother russia = Tier -2

 

Some planes are well tierd, some not.

Edited by anyuser
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For the tiering

 

Axis = Tier +2

Allis = Tier +/-0 (mostly)
mother russia = Tier -2

 

Some planes are well tierd, some not.

 

Just to understand that properly, with the "Axis = Tier +2" you mean ... ehm, what exactly? That the existing tiering of German planes is 2 levels too high, so a current tier 6 plane should be 4?

Or that a current German tier 6 plane should be 8 instead?! I can't imagine you mean the second ... 

 

There are some few planes that are remarkably badly tiered, missed the the proper tier by 3 or 4 levels.

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You Get to fly a Lagg in tier three .

 Now go look at every other Nations fighter in tier three .

 Now you see how he comes up with that formula ?

 BF-109 was in Spanish Civil war Fighting Russian Tier One -reserves -and tier two planes .

 As was the Stuka and He-111 and DO bombers ...

 They then are used in Poland and Belgium and France -THEN Russia AGAIN !! ..

 But Lagg is 1941-42...NOT 1930's ..

 Like Spits and Hurricanes and US mess.

 So If you look at Battle of Britain time period and see UK with planes that fought Germans in tier 2-3-4-5.

 But GERMANS in 4-5-6-7-8-9 ...You get confused !!

 

 Now look at Russia .

 Same thing .

 Except they start at reserve and work up .

 

 Later most everyone catches up to each other .

 

 Japan if we go by History will have Zero AM62 as tier TWO plane .

 It twas at Pearl Harbor was it not ?

 

 So tiering is weirdness squared x pie plus bacon .  Its just a way to make some balance .

 Until you have play and they throw bacon pie into a big pile and all tiers fight bi planes .

 

 So it isn't supposed to make sense yet ,

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And Pearl was when? Not 1939...

Zero fly first in mid 1940. So it is more around the Spit MK2.

 

And yes, Do17, He111 and 109 where in spain. Do17P, He111 up to the P and 109 up to the D.

With some Do17Z (not shure there) and 109E1 for testing near the end of the war. But the Spit was around the time of the E1.

 

Btw, russians where fighting the germans with tier 1 and 2 and reserve planes in 1941. And with the LaGG3 and Mig3 and some Yak1. But that planes where still rare then.

Just to understand that properly, with the "Axis = Tier +2" you mean ... ehm, what exactly? That the existing tiering of German planes is 2 levels too high, so a current tier 6 plane should be 4?

Or that a current German tier 6 plane should be 8 instead?! I can't imagine you mean the second ... 

 

There are some few planes that are remarkably badly tiered, missed the the proper tier by 3 or 4 levels.

I was talking about how Gajin does it.

1945 P63 at the same tier as the 1941 (with 1943 gunpods) 109F. 1939 109E3 2 tiers higher then the 1939 Spit MK1. And the 1941 LaGG3, we don't have to talk about her.

But to be honest, the LaGG is not a good plane. But still, E1 and E3 should be more like Tier 4 (to not fall into the lower group). At best with the E3 at 5 because of its cannons. But one group above the Spit1...

Edited by anyuser
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here a webpage with nice informations of the me 109 

 

www.kurfurst.org    

 

The e1 was built till august 1940. point.. not longer.. so now look which enemies the e1 will meet ingame ? every sb will bring it down. every maxed out lagg will bring it down... nearly everything can bring it down. but in fact it was the plane of the polish and french blitz krieg time. meating there what ? the rate is stupid op with its chainsaw gun.. in fact they had been outclassed in 1941 by the me109. never there is taken into account, that the german pilot of the 1940 time had already war experience... never added to the abilities of the plane. and like that, the 1944 models should suffer due to the fact, that germany pushed unexperienced joung pilots into battle. but perhaps this can t be solved in such a game. but something can be changed : rata was never like it is ingame and il2 was a ground attacker, NEVEr like ingame a fighter lol... so obvious, the devs have something to do if they want something historical correct ( i mean a little bit ). 

Edited by wildwilly39430
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