Is sim worth playing?

[DouggieMacArthur 41]

Title has all the words I need. Is it worth playing sim or not?

[HauptmannPingu 294]

4 hours ago, Half_Life_Scient said:

Title has all the words I need. Is it worth playing sim or not?

No, the rewards are really very dreadful for you effort, and pretty poor regardless. The spawn costs for non premium planes are horrendous, and the reward system is dreadful. 

[[email protected] 6]

With all the faults it has, I still think it’s worth it. Especially on console. When I first started playing WT back in 2014, I stuck with Air RB as I did not have a flight stick. I switched to SB EC a couple years ago and it was much more fun for me. This disadvantage console players have is because of the controls. In realistic and arcade modes, PC users can essentially point and click to shoot because of the instructor mode (if you look at YouTube videos, they are always using instructor mode); that advantage goes away in SB mode and our controls scheme is much closer to being equal. The other problem I had personally was that I cannot fly in 3rd person and dog-fight another player (it isn’t that fun); I always kept using the cockpit view or virtual cockpit view for the planes that didn’t have a modeled interior yet. I have tried going back to RB on occasion and I just cannot compete anymore regardless of using the flight stick or the PS controller. Arcade mode is even worse on console and I hate the special edition matches (like April Fools) because of the air arcade mode; I did like the Sand Worm one we had this year since arcade ground isn’t anywhere near as horrible as air arcade.

[Schindibee 2,856]

20 hours ago, Half_Life_Scient said:

Title has all the words I need. Is it worth playing sim or not?

No, title doesn't have that.

Sim what? Air? Ground? EC?

 

For me, atm Air Sim EC is the game mode I enjoy most, because:

 

- it's the only mode where bombers and attackers have a reasonable chance to survive - in I like to move mud...

- it's the only mode where moderately realistic flight planing is neccessary/possible/usefull

- it's a great mode for using VR-goggles

- it's (for me at least) quite profitable and rewarding game mode

I don't like the massive "furball-in-a-phonebooth" which is Air RB, and rather plan my routes and tactics carefully, exactly to evade enemy encounters, instead of having to drive my bomb trucks into the maws of everybody seeing me and wanting to kill me on the spot - and allto often succeed to.

 

But that's just me...

[Mursac 87]

No. 

 

After RP was neutered, it is economically not worth the time.  I played an hour and a half in sim yesterday with the Mig-23M for 10,632 RP at 76% battle activity, and a 20 minute match in realistic this morning (an EC map) for 11,814 RP at 63% battle activity.  They could triple RP earnings and it still wouldn't match up in terms of RP per minute. 

 

As a game mode, it's superior.  Slower paced, and more things to do than kill players.  That being said, whoever has made the economic decisions the last couple years is strangling us.  Every attempt so far at micromanaging bad behavior has just made things worse in some way.  I get being an F2P comes with low standards, but really, I just want to be strangled a little more lovingly. 

 

With IL-2 and DCS about to fix the performance issues that have kept WT in the lead (particularly for VR), it looks like sim is on timer.

[esapekkis 2,659]

Yes

[ivica70 910]

If you play premium planes that are cheap to spawn and don't get killed to often - Yes!

 

If you prefer non-premium-planes with horrendous spawn costs and get killed quite often - No!

[Lieutenant_Camel 622]

6 hours ago, Schindibee said:

No, title doesn't have that.

Sim what? Air? Ground? EC?

 

For me, atm Air Sim EC is the game mode I enjoy most, because:

 

- it's the only mode where bombers and attackers have a reasonable chance to survive - in I like to move mud...

- it's the only mode where moderately realistic flight planing is neccessary/possible/usefull

- it's a great mode for using VR-goggles

- it's (for me at least) quite profitable and rewarding game mode

I don't like the massive "furball-in-a-phonebooth" which is Air RB, and rather plan my routes and tactics carefully, exactly to evade enemy encounters, instead of having to drive my bomb trucks into the maws of everybody seeing me and wanting to kill me on the spot - and allto often succeed to.

 

But that's just me...

do the developers even know that EC has potential?

or what people here want?

 

Edited December 15, 2022 by Lieutenant_Camel

[Waelse 272]

On 14/12/2022 at 21:10, Half_Life_Scient said:

Title has all the words I need. Is it worth playing sim or not?

For fun and research yes. But for BP and events sadly no.

[SirWellingt0n 31]

Its fun if you like knowing you're losing money playing. Plus not getting any RP for the time you put in.

[__Tigerwolf__ 100]

On 15/12/2022 at 10:15, Schindibee said:

No, title doesn't have that.

Sim what? Air? Ground? EC?

 

For me, atm Air Sim EC is the game mode I enjoy most, because:

 

- it's the only mode where bombers and attackers have a reasonable chance to survive - in I like to move mud...

- it's the only mode where moderately realistic flight planing is neccessary/possible/usefull

- it's a great mode for using VR-goggles

- it's (for me at least) quite profitable and rewarding game mode

I don't like the massive "furball-in-a-phonebooth" which is Air RB, and rather plan my routes and tactics carefully, exactly to evade enemy encounters, instead of having to drive my bomb trucks into the maws of everybody seeing me and wanting to kill me on the spot - and allto often succeed to.

 

But that's just me...

 

Same reasons. I just can't bother with playing AIR EC anymore because of the horrific economy.

[Schindibee 2,856]

I find it profitable, BUT...

 

...I have premium.

 

and

 

...I tend to use premium vehicles.

 

 

But also if I don't use premium vehicles (A-7D, F-4C,...), I usually come out of the match with a good positive balance!

 

 

What I noticed in @SirWellingt0n post, is the extreme cost of respawns: You must have spawned 8-10 or more times in this one match - quite a lot.

I find that's one of the most important aspects in this game mode, trying to not die too often!

 

Sounds silly, but still worthwile to think about: If you get killed so many times, I strongly reccommend to adjust tactics, playstyle or - sometimes -  quite simply what day you play, as this can depend strongly on where you "land" relative to the "BR-bracket of the day"...

 

I currently try to grind Italy with the G.91 R4 (9.0), but yesterday  the bracket was 8.7-9.7. So that's "A-10/Su-25 time" and not a heatlhy environment for my G.91. So I chose to play something else instead, simple as that.

[[email protected] 35]

3 hours ago, Schindibee said:

I find it profitable, BUT...

 

...I have premium.

 

and

 

...I tend to use premium vehicles.

 

 

But also if I don't use premium vehicles (A-7D, F-4C,...), I usually come out of the match with a good positive balance!

 

 

What I noticed in @SirWellingt0n post, is the extreme cost of respawns: You must have spawned 8-10 or more times in this one match - quite a lot.

I find that's one of the most important aspects in this game mode, trying to not die too often!

 

Sounds silly, but still worthwile to think about: If you get killed so many times, I strongly reccommend to adjust tactics, playstyle or - sometimes -  quite simply what day you play, as this can depend strongly on where you "land" relative to the "BR-bracket of the day"...

 

I currently try to grind Italy with the G.91 R4 (9.0), but yesterday  the bracket was 8.7-9.7. So that's "A-10/Su-25 time" and not a heatlhy environment for my G.91. So I chose to play something else instead, simple as that.

 

I don't find it profitable because on my gr1 harrier in RB I can make 25-30k RP in 10-15 min, but in sim it will take me 1.5-2  hours to make 80k RP

Edited December 19, 2022 by [email protected]

[Steelbeast 558]

Mixed ground sim battles are mostly far better experience then RB.

[yPYRiCeNDUlt 19]

No, Air Sim at least is not worth it economically

You're getting at best like 35%~ the rewards of the same time spent in ARB

Used to be better so hopefully they'll improve the rewards again, no worse feeling in the world than playing for an hour and trying your best and getting 12,000 RP for your efforts

 

 

 

 

[[email protected] 120]

For:

• AIR SIM and Console >> Yes (Actually, as console players, we have to give this answer, because this is the only game with SIM possibility. Hey Xbox players don't come with your fancy MSFS, PS5 players still have only War thunder and only Thrustmaster Hotas 4)

Additionally,

• If your main goal is to get max Silver Lions or max RP that you can get, hell no
• If your goal is enjoying SIM experience, then:
  • If you play Top Tier and have less than 1 mil Silver Lions, hell no
  • If you play Top Tier and rich enough, yes

Laslty, console players still lacks, a compatable VR set (hopefully Gaijin will add PSVR2, but as usual they sayor announce absolute nothing) and better options than Thrusmaster Hotas 4 (which is related with Sony). We already know that Ps5 is very capable of handling with the current graphics

 

 

[Bladigan 29]

I think the main rule to make matches profitable in SB is not to die.

 

I constantly see people flying low, not checking their six, accepting dogfighting in any case... If you want to be a good pilot, not die and be profitable you should allways evaluate each situation and decide carefully what to do. Sometimes is better to run for example and come back later to the area with better energy, altitude, etc. But if you allways keep pushing whatever the situation is you will die a lot. And that implies a lot of SL loss.

[Schindibee 2,856]

46 minutes ago, Bladigan said:

I think the main rule to make matches profitable in SB is not to die.

 

...

Yes.

 

For me - I'm a dedicated bomber/attacker pilot - SIm EC is THE game mode to go to, as it's the only mode where bombers and attackers can do their job as they are supposed to: Evasive, getting out of the way of trouble as well as possible, then striking as hard as possible and return safely to start again.

 

May sound boring to some, but as you constantly need to plan, adjust and check, you have enough to do to complete your job AND survive at the same time. ANd remember: Fighter pilots make movies, bomber pilots make history, right?  = )

 

Still, some aspects I pay special attention to when fling in this mode:

 

• Try to use permium vehicles if you have them, as they tend to have massively lower repair/spawn costs, while having nice RP and SL boni. Just compare regular F-84F (24'317 SL) to Israeli F-84F Premium (5'240 SL) - same aircraft, but 4.6x less painful if you loose one! And if you have premium time too, all the bettern, and then quite easy to print cash in Sim EC.

 

•  If you're in a plane "at the bottom of the foodchain", fly very defensively and avoid contact with the enemy at all costs. Check the map for areas where there is a lot of action (e.g.  point being capped by enemy aircraft, areas where players try to hunt down enemy attackers and bombers,...) and avoid if possible. NOTE: BR-ranges rotate daily (iirc), so the aircraft where today you are the top, next day you will be at the bottom. Then maybe select to fly something else instead (example: did very well in Italian Premium G.91 as fighter when in 8.3-9.3 bracket, then a day later the bracket was 8.7-9.7 - that's A-10/Su-25 Country and a very deadly environment for my AIM-9B armed Gina.! SO I chose not to fly the G.91 in Sim EC that specific day...)

 

• Mark your position frequently, especially in high-risk areas. Thus you not only help avoiding getting TK'ed, but you also motivate others to do the same, and if everybody does this, one gets a good situational picture of who is where, and what is happening there.

 

• Hug the ground! You are more difficult to spot, to engage and to kill if you're low. Use the landscape, valleys, mountains, rivers, etc!

 

•  Know how to handle your aircraft! I often see red or blue players just crash, and I observe often how badly people for example (try to) land their aircraft. Loosing SL because you're not minding proper airspeeds and flaps, gear etc. is a unneccessary way to loose SL. But happens to me to, of course. Only yesterday lawndarted my Intruder once because not being careful, and ripped my gear off another time just because I did not take that extra second look at my gear indicator after take off. Silly.)

 

 

 

[_Yoschi_ 688]

On 21/12/2022 at 09:18, Schindibee said:

Yes.

 

For me - I'm a dedicated bomber/attacker pilot - SIm EC is THE game mode to go to, as it's the only mode where bombers and attackers can do their job as they are supposed to: Evasive, getting out of the way of trouble as well as possible, then striking as hard as possible and return safely to start again.

I believe you like these "not" new pve lobbys... 

On 21/12/2022 at 09:18, Schindibee said:

May sound boring to some, but as you constantly need to plan, adjust and check, you have enough to do to complete your job AND survive at the same time. ANd remember: Fighter pilots make movies, bomber pilots make history, right?  = )

Planning?? You're joking ?? When you have prem ACC prem plane one thing what you need to plan it's bomb enemy AF every 15 min and J out...

On 21/12/2022 at 09:18, Schindibee said:

• Try to use permium vehicles if you have them, as they tend to have massively lower repair/spawn costs, while having nice RP and SL boni. Just compare regular F-84F (24'317 SL) to Israeli F-84F Premium (5'240 SL) - same aircraft, but 4.6x less painful if you loose one! And if you have premium time too, all the bettern, and then quite easy to print cash in Sim EC.

Just delete all other vehicles... Or make them all premiums...

Why we can't play what we like??

On 21/12/2022 at 09:18, Schindibee said:

•  If you're in a plane "at the bottom of the foodchain", fly very defensively and avoid contact with the enemy at all costs. Check the map for areas where there is a lot of action (e.g.  point being capped by enemy aircraft, areas where players try to hunt down enemy attackers and bombers,...) and avoid if possible. NOTE: BR-ranges rotate daily (iirc), so the aircraft where today you are the top, next day you will be at the bottom. Then maybe select to fly something else instead (example: did very well in Italian Premium G.91 as fighter when in 8.3-9.3 bracket, then a day later the bracket was 8.7-9.7 - that's A-10/Su-25 Country and a very deadly environment for my AIM-9B armed Gina.! SO I chose not to fly the G.91 in Sim EC that specific day...)

Or just join farmer lobby in any premium plane.. It's eaiser to find one than not die in proper PvP game... 

(For sake Gajin solve problems he created himself...) 

On 21/12/2022 at 09:18, Schindibee said:

• Hug the ground! You are more difficult to spot, to engage and to kill if you're low. Use the landscape, valleys, mountains, rivers, etc!

Fly low and slow... Way to survive air combat... (I'm doubt that you really play SB)

 

It's a easy fix for at least zoombers

Bring back our rewards and make tweak

-75% reward for lose plane and crew

-50% reward for J out 

-25% reward for crash landing

-0% reward for safe landing

Game play, immersion, team play +1000% 

 

 

Edited December 23, 2022 by _Yoschi_

[Schindibee 2,856]

I just explained what works for me, and yes, I play Sim EC almost exclusively atm, only hopping into a RB match or two to complete a daily task or so.

 

And I never claimed "low and slow" is a way to survive air combat. What I meant is that "very low and tactically smart" can keep you away from a situation where you'd get into a dogfight that can endanger your plane and thus your spawn costs.

 

As to premium vs. regular aircraft, well, you can make them work too perfectly well, it's just that a death is a bit more painfull of course, and rewards are less. Still, before getting the Intruder this patch, it was mainly the A-7 I've flown a lot in Sim for US, and that one is expensive to get killed in. And in UK I've flown the Harrier Gr.1 a lot, and of course my beloved Milan for France - both premiums and cheap to operate (especially the Milan with a meager 5'400 SL)! But I also enjoy to fly the regulars like A-7, Jaguar,...

 

But of course you CAN fly whatever you like! Just like with WT as a whole, there are cost/gain differences between premium and regular vehicles, and of course, there is a reason not every aircraft is treated the same way: Premiums are sold, thus provide not only the player with a bonus in SL and RP gain, but also provides money for the developers, because Gaijin is after all also a business.

 

Attack a base, then J out? Yes, maybe people do that, but I'm not one of them: I fly Sim EC mostly because I enjoy it so much, especially since I have my VR setup. I enjoy to fly, and I enjoy to do this in the most "sim-like" game mode WT offers, enjoying also to take off, plan my route, do my work, get back and try to land again safely back at the base - or even more fun - on a carrier.

[_Yoschi_ 688]

3 hours ago, Schindibee said:

Gaijin is after all also a business.

 

Im don't know one single SB player who don't have premium plane or premium acc. No one have issue with that Gajin is a company. But Gajin long time ago cross greed line. 

4 hours ago, Schindibee said:

Attack a base, then J out? Yes, maybe people do that, but I'm not one of them: I fly Sim EC mostly because I enjoy it so much, especially since I have my VR setup. I enjoy to fly, and I enjoy to do this in the most "sim-like" game mode WT offers, enjoying also to take off, plan my route, do my work, get back and try to land again safely back at the base - or even more fun - on a carrier.

No they don't J out they just crash during strafe runway with rocket. And yes some fighter pilots also want enjoy game...

4 hours ago, Schindibee said:

As to premium vs. regular aircraft, well, you can make them work too perfectly well, it's just that a death is a bit more painfull of course, and rewards are less. Still, before getting the Intruder this patch, it was mainly the A-7 I've flown a lot in Sim for US, and that one is expensive to get killed in. And in UK I've flown the Harrier Gr.1 a lot, and of course my beloved Milan for France - both premiums and cheap to operate (especially the Milan with a meager 5'400 SL)! But I also enjoy to fly the regulars like A-7, Jaguar,...

GR1 and Milan... Like some PR talking spare me that thing...

 

Got 20 min combat destroy 8 enemy planes 2 death's in SB top tier get 20k SL and 9RP. 

 

I have around 55 premium planes and premium acc for 400+ days. How meany money Gajin need from players to fix basic EC bugs like bombers, AAA, farmers, etc!?

 

Most of the life quality fixes are to made in one afternoon. 

 

You are happy that's means everything is perfect?? I bet that you make vote how meany players are happy from SB state 90% player base will answer is a nut shell 

[Schindibee 2,856]

13 minutes ago, _Yoschi_ said:

You are happy that's means everything is perfect?? I bet that you make vote how meany players are happy from SB state 90% player base will answer is a nut shell 

 

It's not as simple as that, not black and white:

 

Yes, I am happy, but I definitely could be happier!

 

No, it is not perfect, and it definitely could easily be made much better!

[[email protected] 6]

1 hour ago, _Yoschi_ said:

Im don't know one single SB player who don't have premium plane or premium acc.

I am one of those players. I have not purchased anything yet from GJ (except Birds of Steel for PS3) and have been playing since 2014 when WT was released for PS4. I might, at some point, purchase a premium plane, but most don’t interest me. The only one that does is the A-10A early….I’m just too cheap to buy it at this time.

[Bloodlet 408]

7 hours ago, Schindibee said:

I just explained what works for me, and yes, I play Sim EC almost exclusively atm, only hopping into a RB match or two to complete a daily task or so.

 

And I never claimed "low and slow" is a way to survive air combat. What I meant is that "very low and tactically smart" can keep you away from a situation where you'd get into a dogfight that can endanger your plane and thus your spawn costs.

 

As to premium vs. regular aircraft, well, you can make them work too perfectly well, it's just that a death is a bit more painfull of course, and rewards are less. Still, before getting the Intruder this patch, it was mainly the A-7 I've flown a lot in Sim for US, and that one is expensive to get killed in. And in UK I've flown the Harrier Gr.1 a lot, and of course my beloved Milan for France - both premiums and cheap to operate (especially the Milan with a meager 5'400 SL)! But I also enjoy to fly the regulars like A-7, Jaguar,...

 

But of course you CAN fly whatever you like! Just like with WT as a whole, there are cost/gain differences between premium and regular vehicles, and of course, there is a reason not every aircraft is treated the same way: Premiums are sold, thus provide not only the player with a bonus in SL and RP gain, but also provides money for the developers, because Gaijin is after all also a business.

 

Attack a base, then J out? Yes, maybe people do that, but I'm not one of them: I fly Sim EC mostly because I enjoy it so much, especially since I have my VR setup. I enjoy to fly, and I enjoy to do this in the most "sim-like" game mode WT offers, enjoying also to take off, plan my route, do my work, get back and try to land again safely back at the base - or even more fun - on a carrier.

I know you're a game master and not a dev but I certainly hope the devs don't take any advice from you regarding the state of the sim economy. It is objectively and demonstrably not in a good place in comparison to the other game modes as evidenced by the multitude of threads on this forum since last year about it which I have previously linked for your viewing in a different thread. Here's yet another example of a player being disgusted with the economy: 

 

Both DCS and War Thunder have had sales over the holidays. War Thunder got $20 of my money for a premium account. By comparison DCS got over $100 of my money with one of their recent sales purely because of the state of sim.

[IesousEinaiTheos 460]

Sim is not worth it at all!!!!!

Economy is absolute trash!
Playerbase is gone, you will go a full week and not find a good competitive game, everyone leaves after 1-2 deaths because they either statpad their KD or they cannot afford deaths due to econ.
Massive bugs (won't get into here).
AAA is stupidly insane! You will die to AAA more than anything else, and no matter how much we complain, Gaijin just keeps increasing (Thankfully it's broken and AAA doesn't due to a bug atm)
The grind is insane, 3 years ago I did my full sweedish tree in a week of hard grinding. 1 year ago I did my israeli tree in 3 days of hard grinding... Today.... I have been grinding the F-16 for israel for 3 days, 3 days for 1 plane AND I KNOW HOW TO GRIND! The Economy is crap!

Anyone who says that sim is worth playing is lying through their teeth or does not play the game and talking out of ignorance.
Join any Sim squadron that is left, ask them if it's worth it... You will get hours of people ranting about what the game used to be and what it is now.

DO NOT PLAY SIM!

Gaijin has stated that SIM is for PvE only just 2 weeks ago. So if you want PvP, best find another game because Gaijin doesn't want you. (They don't want any of us anymore they ignore us and keep ruining their game).