ukraine Ukraine Ground Forces Tree

[leroyonly 4,300]

Guys, keep it on topic. I know that this will stay as a rather volitile topic for the foreseeable future however do keep politics out of it. So far most of you guys have been keeping this suggestion on-topic, please keep it that way. I also cleaned up some of the off-topic stuff.

[DMYEugen 667]

Any of the BTRs equipped with the GROM turret would be nice to see as well.

 

GROM:

Spoiler

 

BTR-4:

Spoiler

 

BTR-70:

Spoiler

 

BTR-80 (Turkmenistani):

Spoiler

 

Edited December 16, 2022 by DMYEugen

[HIMARS_Enjoyer 164]

16 minutes ago, DMYEugen said:

Any of the BTRs equipped with the GROM turret would be nice to see as well.

 

GROM:

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BTR-4:

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BTR-70:

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BTR-80 (Turkmenistani):

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Only BTR-4, cuz BTR-70 and 80 probably reserved by snail for USSR tech tree

But there is already proposition of adding BTR-4, and different weapon module don`t give this BTR any advantage over proposed BTR-4. Only bigger height of BTR, which is already massive

[DMYEugen 667]

8 minutes ago, HIMARS_Enjoyer said:

Only BTR-4, cuz BTR-70 and 80 probably reserved by snail for USSR tech tree

Disagree there. Doesn't make much sense to make them exclusive, especially when Ukraine has quite a few unique BTR-70s and at least 1 unique BTR-80. Plus, the USSR/Russian tree has better alternatives for exclusives.

Edited December 16, 2022 by DMYEugen

[HIMARS_Enjoyer 164]

8 minutes ago, DMYEugen said:

Disagree there. Doesn't make much sense to make them exclusive, especially when Ukraine has quite a few unique BTR-70s and at least 1 unique BTR-80. Plus, the USSR/Russian tree has better alternatives for exclusives.

Are you proposing to fill this TT with many different tech, only to prevent it`s fast grinding?

9 minutes ago, DMYEugen said:

Disagree there. Doesn't make much sense to make them exclusive, especially when Ukraine has quite a few unique BTR-70s and at least 1 unique BTR-80. Plus, the USSR/Russian tree has better alternatives for exclusives.

And i still think it`s bad idea, cuz many tech with same turret and same using in game will be no good. I think there is enough BMP/BTR`s in suggestion. Even rare like BTR-94/Kevlar-E etc.

[HIMARS_Enjoyer 164]

 I think it`s enough IFV`s and BTR`s. i will definitely grind them all (and this 8.7-10.0 part is going to be in my setup definitely) to fill my setup if nation will be added into the game.

[DMYEugen 667]

17 minutes ago, HIMARS_Enjoyer said:

Are you proposing to fill this TT with many different tech, only to prevent it`s fast grinding?

And i still think it`s bad idea, cuz many tech with same turret and same using in game will be no good. I think there is enough BMP/BTR`s in suggestion. Even rare like BTR-94/Kevlar-E etc.

I never suggested for them all to be tech tree vehicles. Each of the GROM fitted BTRs could be implemented differently. (BTR-4 tech tree, BTR-80 event, BTR-70 premium.) We're just going to have to agree to disagree here because I believe in adding as many vehicles as possible and you don't. Simple as.

Edited December 16, 2022 by DMYEugen

[HIMARS_Enjoyer 164]

6 minutes ago, DMYEugen said:

I never suggested for them all to be tech tree vehicles. Each of the GROM fitted BTRs could be implemented differently. (BTR-4 tech tree, BTR-80 event, BTR-70 premium.) We're just going to have to agree to disagree here because I believe in adding as many vehicles as possible and you don't. Simple as.

Okay. BTR-4 with GROM under classic BTR-4 (for someone who want to collect all), all others- in event vehicles.

[Yontzee 1,555]

1 hour ago, DMYEugen said:

Disagree there. Doesn't make much sense to make them exclusive, especially when Ukraine has quite a few unique BTR-70s and at least 1 unique BTR-80. Plus, the USSR/Russian tree has better alternatives for exclusives.

 

1 hour ago, HIMARS_Enjoyer said:

Okay. BTR-4 with GROM under classic BTR-4 (for someone who want to collect all), all others- in event vehicles.

I think I can tweak it to include a BTR-4 with the GROM turret and/or add the BTR-70/BTR-80 

[ZVO_12_INCH 492]

11 hours ago, Bigboi_SaiGon said:

@Yontzee From my respect for this post, I have chosen "Yes" and "No"

• Yes because Ukraine Armored Vehicle are having some gems in it and I want UKR vehicles participated in this game.
• No because I found out that Ukraine have some major problems like no air tree, helicopter tree ( If they had, it's just a knockoff of the USSR tree. No offensive.) I felt like the Ukraine should started at rank 6 not the 4 like Israel because their base tank are T-64,T-84 and derivatives, BTRs, SPG and some modify SPAAG and SAM. And those are highly effective though.( T34 and T54/55 were invented in Kharkov/Kharkiv. I knew it but it is belong to the Ukraine SSR not the modern Ukraine.). The last one is the tree is big but not big enough to form a independent tree and not small enough to form a sub-tree like the Finnish/S-African tree.

So my suggestion is kept the Ukraine tech tree in the USSR tree but have Second Ground Tab which could be a precedent for all other trees. Players need grind to 9.0 ( T64A-1979) either they can choose to continue to grind the main tech tree or the can choose to grind the second ground tree. So they can use the same Air and Heli tree. But's when come to Mixed battle they will be separated from the main tree( Quite difficult for the Devs and matchmakers). They used to stand in the same side but now they stand head to head.

I made this because I don't want to grind another Soviet-ish tree and I have works and class to do. And I don't want people to harass each other for what problems which I don't care but I feel bad when War Thunder's  players are being teared apart for World major problems.

T-54 tanks...T-55-were invented in Nizhny Tagil...

T-54....Here...

T-55...Work on the creation of a tank based on the T-54B medium tank was started in 1957 at Plant No. 183 on an initiative basis under the leadership of L. N. Kartsev. ...

To save space and time, a link from the Wiki...Т-55 — Википедия (wikipedia.org)

[Yontzee 1,555]

40 minutes ago, ZVO_12_INCH said:

T-54 tanks...T-55-were invented in Nizhny Tagil...

T-54....Here...

T-55...Work on the creation of a tank based on the T-54B medium tank was started in 1957 at Plant No. 183 on an initiative basis under the leadership of L. N. Kartsev. ...

To save space and time, a link from the Wiki...Т-55 — Википедия (wikipedia.org)

They were produced in Ukraine as well, maybe that’s what they were referring to. Not invented though, Soviet design team.

Edited December 17, 2022 by Yontzee

[ZVO_12_INCH 492]

51 minutes ago, Yontzee said:

They were produced in Ukraine as well, maybe that’s what they were referring to. Not invented though, Soviet design team.

T34 and T54/55 were invented in Kharkov/Kharkiv.

No, that's not what he meant...it is INVENTED, not PRODUCED...

Edited December 17, 2022 by ZVO_12_INCH

[Bigboi_SaiGon 20]

8 hours ago, ZVO_12_INCH said:

T34 and T54/55 were invented in Kharkov/Kharkiv.

No, that's not what he meant...it is INVENTED, not PRODUCED...

My fault. Sorry

[ZVO_12_INCH 492]

2 hours ago, Bigboi_SaiGon said:

My fault. Sorry

Probably soon Yontzee we will be presented with a truly Ukrainian modernization...T-55AGM..

Spoiler

You'd better tell us what Dynamic Protection is installed on your upgraded T-54M...

Spoiler

 

Edited December 17, 2022 by ZVO_12_INCH

[Yontzee 1,555]

23 minutes ago, ZVO_12_INCH said:

Probably soon Yontzee we will be presented with a truly Ukrainian modernization...T-55AGM..

Reveal hidden contents

You'd better tell us what Dynamic Protection is installed on your upgraded T-54M...

Reveal hidden contents

 

I wanted to add the T-62AGM and T-55AGM but I had a hard time finding a good BR for them. Nozh ERA they’re equipped with is pretty solid, and since there’s not going to be a change in ammunition (as far as I’m aware of) it may force the two vehicles to too high of a BR, more then they can handle. As I stated in the disclaimer, the tree is fluid with vehicles able to be added or removed. I’ll see what I can do with it after some more looking into  

 

The T-55AGM and T-62AGM are in my “Future Additions” section in the suggestion with many other vehicles I’m looking into possibly integrating.

[Admiral_Aruon 2,260]

i'm all for it and other post-SSR subtrees. they're all the same base tanks generally so it's actually probably not as much work as subtrees like South Africa.

[Bigboi_SaiGon 20]

2 hours ago, ZVO_12_INCH said:

Probably soon Yontzee we will be presented with a truly Ukrainian modernization...T-55AGM..

Reveal hidden contents

You'd better tell us what Dynamic Protection is installed on your upgraded T-54M...

Reveal hidden contents

 

I can't tell u that because it's classified. The only thing public about the protection is T54M got 2nd gen ERA( less effective than K-5 but better than K-1 against chemical round, act the same when fight against kinetic round.) But 2nd gen thermal though.

[Yontzee 1,555]

1 minute ago, [email protected] said:

 

Understandable, as for UI, it can be modified to fit any amount of vehicles, it would never be a issue, I have a bit of UI development experience myself. 
 

 

That’s not really a issue.

The game can be modified of course and I think it will be eventually. It needs it.

 

I disagree because there’s always been complaints about grinding the tree, especially by players who lack premium status. In your case maybe not an issue (not to much for me either), but for many it can be. Situational. 

[Yontzee 1,555]

Small adjustments of the tree to include more premium and event vehicles to fill gaps. Main focus was swapping out some Soviet-era vehicles for more unique variants. Nothing is permanent and is subject to change as needed.

 

Added: 

• T-55AM - Researchable
  • Note: This vehicle is the Ukrainian modernization, not Soviet/Warsaw design.
• BTR-70DI - Researchable
  • Note: Added under the Tank Destroyer line due to its heaviest armament being the Barrier-212, information can be found at the 'Additional Thoughts' section of this comment.
• T-55AGM - Event
• BTR-4A (GROM) - Squadron
• BRM-1K - Premium
  Georgian Vehicles - Premium
  • Note(s):
    • Experimental, subject to change from Feedback or alternative options open.
    • Main purpose was to mimic other trees in-game with the use of foreign vehicles that have semi-related/shared technology i.e. Georgia purchasing munitions and IFV's from Ukraine.
• T-34-85 no. 33 - Premium

Moved:

• BTR-94 - Moved to Researchable from Premium
• BMP-1UM - Moved to Event from Squadron

Removed (for now):

• BTR-60PB-T
• T-55AMV
• T-72B1

Additional Thoughts: 

• I was looking into the BTR-80 'Joker' as maybe an event/premium but I have no idea where to put it. It wouldn't be able to go higher than Rank V but I don't want to have modern vehicles overlap with early Cold War/World War II vehicles. All for suggestions.
• I saw Ukraine was using a BTR-60 or 70, I cannot remember which one but it had a BMP-1 turret which would be a unique, lower rank premium. 
• Possibility of adding Azerbaijani vehicles as researchable/premium/event due to the military cooperation between Ukraine and Azerbaijan, which is similar to that of Georgia and Ukraine. T-72 ASLAN and/or ZKDM Scout vehicle may be looked into however, nothing is certain.
• Looking into adding the BRM-1K as a possible premium or maybe researchable. Option available thanks to feedback. 
• Limited on ideas on filling gaps for the following lines: LT line from BR ~5.0-7.3, SPAA line from 5.3-6.7.
• Looking for other ideas for the T-54's or options to build off of them.
• Updated the 'Honorable Mentions/Future Additions' tab at the bottom of the suggestion.
• Added a very unique, Ukrainian modified vehicle to the tank destroyer line. It's a modernized BTR-70 dubbed the BTR-70DI (BTR-7) that is equipped with a modified turret and Zaslin hard-kill APS. It utilizes a fully-stabilized 14.5mm KPVT Heavy Machine Gun on top of a 7.62mm coaxial machine gun, KBA-117 30mm grenade launcher, and a Barrier-212 missile system. Other features were an updated drive train/engine, laser rangefinder and day/night sight for the Gunner, and panoramic IR sight for the Commander. The BTR-70DI is in use with the Ukrainian Armed Forces. Adding this vehicle give Ukraine 2x vehicles with indigenous Hard-kill APS (with the option of a 3rd) on top of having 5x vehicles with Soft-kill APS such as the Shtora-1.

A BTR-7DI on display with the Zaslin and 'Bug' Combat Module equipped.

Edited December 19, 2022 by Yontzee

[Colerend 221]

+1 but I would prefer it to be a Sub Tree for countries like Poland. You wouldn't need that copy paste stuff and stuff from other countries.

[[email protected] 69]

Object 477a1 nota

 

[HIMARS_Enjoyer 164]

34 minutes ago, [email protected] said:

Object 477a1 nota

 

[Dewastor 327]

3 hours ago, Yontzee said:

 

Removed (for now):

• T-55AMV

 

  Why is bricky boi gone 

[HIMARS_Enjoyer 164]

1 hour ago, Colerend said:

+1 but I would prefer it to be a Sub Tree for countries like Poland. You wouldn't need that copy paste stuff and stuff from other countries.

What about Eastern Europe league? Ukraine, Poland, Chech, and other countries

[ZVO_12_INCH 492]

3 hours ago, Yontzee said:

Small adjustments of the tree to include more premium and event vehicles to fill gaps. Main focus was swapping out some Soviet-era vehicles for more unique variants. Nothing is permanent and is subject to change as needed.

 

Added: 

• T-55AM - Researchable
  • Note: This vehicle is the Ukrainian modernization, not Soviet/Warsaw design.

The T-55AM_ is not a Ukrainian modernization....It's still-Soviet/Warsaw design...
The whole "modernization" in Ukrainian is to remove the V-1 index from the tank designation and add 4 sheets of rubber on the tank turret...

Spoiler

The T-55 samples with the V-46-5M engine received the T-55M-1 index. Tanks without a guided weapons system — T-55M1, and those of them that were equipped with a V-46-5M engine — T55M1-1. Variants of cars without additional reservation, but with mounted dynamic protection had the designation T-55MV, with the engine B-46-5M — T-55MV1-1...

The T-55M/AM tanks also received the Kontakt-1: dynamic protection elements were installed in the front of the hull on the upper and lower frontal plates (44 and 12 EDZ, respectively), on the turret (50 EDZ), as well as in the front of the on-board rubber screens (from 10 to 43 EDZ per board).

Machines with KDZ were adopted in 1984 and received the T-55MV/AMV index. The weapon system on them remained similar to the T-55M...

P.S...to partially make it Ukrainian-the information that is in the containers from Kontact-1 can...the DZ "Knife" is installed...if you find such information...

 

 

Edited December 19, 2022 by ZVO_12_INCH

[HIMARS_Enjoyer 164]

3 hours ago, Yontzee said:

Small adjustments of the tree to include more premium and event vehicles to fill gaps. Main focus was swapping out some Soviet-era vehicles for more unique variants. Nothing is permanent and is subject to change as needed.

Moved:

• BMP-1UM - Moved to Event from Squadron

Removed (for now):

• T-55AMV

 

Please, no event with BMP-1UM
T-55 AMV is russian, so it had to be removed.

 

This is Ukrainian T-55 modernisation

2 minutes ago, ZVO_12_INCH said:

The T-55AM_ is not a Ukrainian modernization....It's still-Soviet/Warsaw design...
The whole "modernization" in Ukrainian is to remove the V-1 index from the tank designation and add 4 sheets of rubber on the tank turret...

Hide contents

The T-55 samples with the V-46-5M engine received the T-55M-1 index. Tanks without a guided weapons system — T-55M1, and those of them that were equipped with a V-46-5M engine — T55M1-1. Variants of cars without additional reservation, but with mounted dynamic protection had the designation T-55MV, with the engine B-46-5M — T55MV1-1...

The T-55M/AM tanks also received the Kontakt-1: dynamic protection elements were installed in the front of the hull on the upper and lower frontal plates (44 and 12 EDZ, respectively), on the turret (50 EDZ), as well as in the front of the on-board rubber screens (from 10 to 43 EDZ per board).

Machines with KDZ were adopted in 1984 and received the T-55MV/AMV index. The weapon system on them remained similar to the T-55M...

P.S...to partially make it Ukrainian-the information that is in the containers from Kontact-1 can...the DZ "Knife" is installed...if you find such information...

 

Heheheh, i said same rn