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Nerf russian IFV's anti-air capabities.


Thodin
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Its out of control. I'm finally fed up with beeing instantly killed by BMPs or this new 2S38 as soon as I spawn a heli or 9.0ish plane. 

 

Planes and helis of the 60/70/80ties have no chance vs this new op mechanic. Why do I pay 600 spawn points just to be killed seconds after spawn? And its not even an SPAA? Why are russian BMPs/2S38 that effective vs air? I've never read anything about this? Where is it coming from?

 

 

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6 minutes ago, Thodin said:

And its not even an SPAA? Why are russian BMPs/2S38 that effective vs air? I've never read anything about this? Where is it coming from?

Cannot tell for BMPs, but 2S38 is SPAA by every Russian source. Maybe better question is "Why it designated as light tank WT?"

 

https://bmpd.livejournal.com/2809618.html

https://war-book.ru/samohodnaya-artillerijskaya-ustanovka-2s38-derivatsiya/

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5 minutes ago, KH_Alan said:

Cannot tell for BMPs, but 2S38 is SPAA by every Russian source. Maybe better question is "Why it designated as light tank WT?"

 

https://bmpd.livejournal.com/2809618.html

https://war-book.ru/samohodnaya-artillerijskaya-ustanovka-2s38-derivatsiya/

Better question; Why did Gaijin violate their own rules in adding a vehicle that is still in testing trials?

 

Both vehicles in question need to be uptiered, additionally. 

 

10.7-11.0, respectively. Anything lower is criminal.

Edited by GNDM [email protected]
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34 minutes ago, PacketlossRedux said:

how to cas at high tiers:

  1. snake **** it
  2. stay above lock-on range.

yeah i know, you cant just barge in, big sad.

What about stock helicopters?, also, what about vehicles that dont have guided munitions yet? oh right, the 2s38 will stop them without them having a shred of rp.

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3 minutes ago, [email protected] said:

What about stock helicopters?, also, what about vehicles that dont have guided munitions yet? oh right, the 2s38 will stop them without them having a shred of rp.

So will do any SPAA with HE-VT like M247 (9.0 B.R.) or VEAK 40 (8.7 B.R.). What is even that argument? 

 

We need more vechicles like that, not less. Air was ruling for long enough, each nation should get a vechicle like 2S38 :good:

Edited by ULQ_LOVER
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Just now, ULQ_LOVER said:

So will do any SPAA with HE-VT like M247 (9.0 B.R.) or VEAK 40 (8.7 B.R.). What is even that argument? 

but who spawns those right away? rarely those are the first vehicles spawned on the enemy team, also, the tracking on the BMP-2M and 2s38 is ridiculous, neither of those should sit at there brs if they get this feature.

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30 minutes ago, PacketlossRedux said:

how to cas at high tiers:

  1. snake **** it
  2. stay above lock-on range.

yeah i know, you cant just barge in, big sad.

 

There is no "high tier" around 9.x BR. 9.0ish +/- Cas has barely the capability to stay out of range of this unfailable new IFV lock + lead marker. There's usually also no LWR or any warning system for Sabres, G-91, Hueys, Bo-105 etc... . In case of SPAAs you have your radar warning...but these BMP armada...they're everywhere and there's no way to avoid them.

 

The aviability is probably the main issue. Before that last patch rus had to spawn dedicated anti air vehicles to defend vs. air. Now most russian light tanks can just do it as sidegrade. BMPs are very frequently spawned vehicles...from the first to the last second of any match there are plenty of russian lights everywhere. A playing field full of SPAA capable light tanks, without sacrificing anti ground capabilities. Any other nation would need to spawn several SPAAs like Ozelots to be equally effective, but would be stomped on the ground as result. Its unbalanced. 

 

This doesn't even accounts for this new 2S38...which is the pinnacle of bias.

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Just now, [email protected] said:

but who spawns those right away? rarely those are the first vehicles spawned on the enemy team, also, the tracking on the BMP-2M and 2s38 is ridiculous, neither of those should sit at there brs if they get this feature.

So air should have an easy footing :lol2:? We need more vechicles like that, not less. 

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2 minutes ago, ULQ_LOVER said:

So will do any SPAA with HE-VT like M247 (9.0 B.R.) or VEAK 40 (8.7 B.R.). What is even that argument? 

 

We need more vechicles like that, not less. Air was ruling for long enough, each nation should get a vechicle like 2S38 :good:

 

You need to spawn these as dedicated anti air units...usually the team loses combat power on the ground and only tend to bring them if neccessary. BMPs aren't like this.

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1 minute ago, Thodin said:

You need to spawn these as dedicated anti air units...usually the team loses combat power on the ground and only tend to bring them if neccessary. BMPs aren't like this.

1 minute ago, [email protected] said:

we need more spaa, not vehicles that are discount spaa's.

Ground units around 8.7+ need more vechicles with HE-VT and the systems that BMPs and some others got. In that scenario, air units will have to first think, then attack, not like in the past where when flying a plane You could just destroy everything as SPAA couldn't do much about You :lol2:

 

 

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Just now, ULQ_LOVER said:

Ground units around 8.7+ need more vechicles with HE-VT and the systems that BMPs and some others got. In that scenario, air units will have to first think, then attack, not like in the past where when flying a plane You could just destroy everything as SPAA couldn't do much about You :lol2:

 

 

:facepalm:So, in other words, you think that we need he-vt on every single vehicle? then whats the point of evn having spaa in the game?

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Just now, [email protected] said:

:facepalm:So, in other words, you think that we need he-vt on every single vehicle? then whats the point of evn having spaa in the game?

Read again, and then You will understand:

"Ground units around 8.7+ need more vechicles..."

SPAA has radar, light tanks don't. 

Edited by ULQ_LOVER
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Just now, ULQ_LOVER said:

Read again, and then You will understand:

"Ground units around 8.7+ need more vechicles..."

SPAA has radar, light tanks don't. 

light tanks didn't, now its just gonna turn into a nightmare, we dont need more non-spaa's with Anti-air weaponry, that is why SPAA exist, to counter CAS, if more and more light tanks were added above 8.7 with anti-air weaponry, what would be the point of spawning in spaa in 8.7+

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1 minute ago, ULQ_LOVER said:

Read again, and then You will understand:

"Ground units around 8.7+ need more vechicles..."

SPAA has radar, light tanks don't. 

 

The IRST lock + autotracking + lead marker beats every radar lock by far. It doesn't suffer from radar echos above the ground and the lock isn't fluctuating/wobbling as radar locks usually do. 

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1 minute ago, [email protected] said:

light tanks didn't, now its just gonna turn into a nightmare, we dont need more non-spaa's with Anti-air weaponry, that is why SPAA exist, to counter CAS, if more and more light tanks were added above 8.7 with anti-air weaponry, what would be the point of spawning in spaa in 8.7+

Light tanks don't have radar. Light tanks will see You if You will make a mistake and then, they are able to defend themself against You (good thing compared to how things were in the past).

 

Ground units need more light tanks like that, not less.

Just now, Thodin said:

The IRST lock + autotracking + lead marker beats every radar lock by far. It doesn't suffer from radar echos above the ground and the lock isn't fluctuating/wobbling as radar locks usually do. 

It doesn't beat any radar, as any good pilot of air unit will be able to kill the light tank before it sees You :good:. 8.7 helis already have ATGMs that can be fired from over 3 km distance, if You want a free frags then sorry but no sorry :lol2:

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Just now, [email protected] said:

light tanks didn't, now its just gonna turn into a nightmare, we dont need more non-spaa's with Anti-air weaponry, that is why SPAA exist, to counter CAS, if more and more light tanks were added above 8.7 with anti-air weaponry, what would be the point of spawning in spaa in 8.7+

You say that like as if SPAA within the 8.7/9.7 range couldn’t already barely counter any semi competent CAS user , let alone fully competent one, most helis are nigh untouched to even HE VT if the user isn’t brain dead 

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2 minutes ago, ULQ_LOVER said:

The only one with no reason is the one who thinks that air units should have an upper hand all the time :good:

when have i ever sated this? oh wait, i haven't. All i'm saying is that the current vehicles or othes that are to come (light tanks and mbts) have no right being below 10.3 if they have aircraft tracking capabilities.

Edited by [email protected]
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1 minute ago, glock991 said:

You say that like as if SPAA within the 8.7/9.7 range couldn’t already barely counter any semi competent CAS user , let alone fully competent one, most helis are nigh untouched to even HE VT if the user isn’t brain dead 

He just wants to have free frags with his air units :lol2:

1 minute ago, [email protected] said:

when have i ever sated this? oh wait, i haven't. All i'm saying is that the current vehicles or othes that are to come (light tanks and mbts) have no right being below 10.3 if they have aircraft tracking capabilities.

So no air units at that B.R. should have better capabilities than SPAAs :good:

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1 hour ago, GNDM [email protected] said:

Better question; Why did Gaijin violate their own rules in adding a vehicle that is still in testing trials?

 

There has never been a rule against adding vehicles that are test or experimental vehicles, even if they are current. There are many examples of them throughout the game in every nation (experimental/prototypical). 

 

There are also plenty of examples of vehicles introduced to the game in / around the same time as they were in reality, such as the Leopard 2PL. 

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