What is the point spawning in a full uptier?

[Rheniaa 451]

Hello, 

 

My question is:

what is the point of spawning in a full +1.0 uptier? (6.7 - 8.7)

 

- Lower tier tanks cost more to repair then higher ones (Conq vs A1A1, Caer vs T55AM, Chief mk3 vs XM1 etc)

- Lower tier tanks have to use its best ammo to even harm higher ones, meaning ammo costs too high

- Lower tier tanks have less SL income multiplier as higher ones, meaning you get less SL if you kill a +1.0BR higher tank

 

Best solution until they fix this (never) is to leave the game as the match starts or bring a meme tank (FV4005) and try to have fun. At least they are cheap to repair.

 

[Valcour 1,136]

1.  It does support your team.

2. The drive and shoot like a raving lunatic approach can be fun when consuming adult beverages.

3.  You just might kill a few of the xxxxxxxx. 

 

You are right though, repair/ammo costs really do need a complete revamp.  They really don't work well as a balancing tool.

 

 

 

[Jurrunio 15]

Still beats getting revenge bombed when you're top BR

 

*thumbs up with tears*

[FatNSlo 159]

I think everyone is full uptier most of the time.  Only a lucky few in a match will be full downtier, and a few partial uptier.

 

Just remember when you're in a full uptier match, the majority of the enemy team is full uptier too.

 

At least that's been my experience.  It's not like I've ever faced a full uptier team.

[WolFie90 491]

Wait...
Someone is THAT cheap, to not use the best ammo all the time? 

[TheKatyusHATman 1,264]

13 hours ago, Rheniaa said:

- Lower tier tanks cost more to repair then higher ones (Conq vs A1A1, Caer vs T55AM, Chief mk3 vs XM1 etc)

only conqueror is a valid point, the other 2 have no point, comparing TT vehicles to prem vehicles is useless, prems always much cheaper

 

13 hours ago, Rheniaa said:

- Lower tier tanks have to use its best ammo to even harm higher ones, meaning ammo costs too high

its true to all BR and uptiers, even a 1.0-2.0 uptier has the same "issue", and sometime you have to use the best of your ammo to scratch a vehicle from the same br. so this is BS

and this is simply complaining you cant OHK a whole br higher vehicle, cant pen frontaly then flank it

 

there was this battle of mine, i played t-34-85 at a full uptier, played against usa, full of t34s and m26s and i got 7 kills without death

there is a point in spawning at a full uptier, but you have to think to be successful

[Rheniaa 451]

8 hours ago, TheKatyusHATman said:

only conqueror is a valid point, the other 2 have no point, comparing TT vehicles to prem vehicles is useless, prems always much cheaper

 

According to Devs no, repair costs has nothing to do with premium status.

(Harrier GR1, Somua SM, Hornet Mk1, Attacker FB2, FW190, just to name a few)

[MrDane 62]

Do what I do, leave. No, it is not our job to play in an uptier, if you do not enjoy the game, leave and find another. It is not your fault, it is Gaijin's fault. If they are unable to create a even game with 90.000 people claimed to be online, they should hire someone that can help them.

Yes, my last three games were uptiers too.

[Rheniaa 451]

What i dont understand is:

 

Why cant be some matches only 6.7 vs 6.7 maybe 6.7 vs 7.0 if there are enough players at that BR range?

 

Before they said its because there arent enough tanks at some brackets, and the game would not be that "diverse".

How is that "diverse" if you see 70-80% premiums and some other tanks vs other 70-80% premiums. (XM1 vs L44+MTCA+30SUPER) 

[TheKatyusHATman 1,264]

8 hours ago, Rheniaa said:

 

According to Devs no, repair costs has nothing to do with premium status.

(Harrier GR1, Somua SM, Hornet Mk1, Attacker FB2, FW190, just to name a few)

yeah, all are planes and one french heavy tank, but lets compare prem vehicles what have their TT variants:

t-55am is cheaper than t-55a, t-72av is cheaper than t-72a or t-72b, is-2 rev is cheaper than is-2 (44), leo L/44 is cheaper than a1a1 or 1a5, tiger II sla.16 is much cheaper than TT tiger II, bfw.jagdpanther is cheaper than TT jagdpanther, magach is cheaper than m48 or m60, m46 "tiger" is cheaper than TT m46, t29 is cheaper than t34

i looked it up in game, and somua is still cheaper than amx m4, amx-50, char 25t and lorraine, and for the planes you mentioned they have a similar or slightly cheaper RP cost to their TT variants

 

my point still stand, premium vehicles are relatively cheaper than TT vehicles

[CoffeeBean100 2,893]

12 hours ago, Rheniaa said:

 

According to Devs no, repair costs has nothing to do with premium status.

(Harrier GR1, Somua SM, Hornet Mk1, Attacker FB2, FW190, just to name a few)

 

And the fact the Premium Comet costs more than the identical tech tree version.

 

There is very little consistency at times with this game.

[CoffeeBean100 2,893]

12 hours ago, MrDane said:

Do what I do, leave. No, it is not our job to play in an uptier, if you do not enjoy the game, leave and find another. It is not your fault, it is Gaijin's fault. If they are unable to create a even game with 90.000 people claimed to be online, they should hire someone that can help them.

Yes, my last three games were uptiers too.

 

Which is just a Snowflake issue really.

 

Beyond compression issues the uptier situation is part and parcel of WT and every match to be one BR (which is essentially what people seem to be asking for) is a terrible idea.

 

They game has survived 8 years like this with every player aware of the system from day 1. So it isn't really a problem, just people focusing on completely the wrong issue where balance is concerned.

 

Really, what do people want here? For them personally to be top BR most matches? (Cough...snowflake) For all matches to be one BR? (With no thought to how they would effect vehicles BRs and the 10 minute ueye with some dead BRs) Because the complaint about uptiers makes no sense.

 

If you are in the full uptier and can't kill the vehicles on the opposing team in the same uptier situation, with support from vehicles up to a full BR above you, then maybe more practice is needed, or a different outlook from being the only person on the side.

 

Proof in pudding, generally it is the skill/experience of the player (and a big spoonful of luck) that overshadows BR of them in said match. But it seems too many appear to think small and just blame their BR placement (and create some insane conspiracy theories on the way).

 

Full uptier is personal, your team isn't in a full uptier.

, and every match you ever play has pretty much always had this setup, yet so many seem ignorant until some other aspect of the game starts to aggravate. There is no point being full downtier if the rest of the team are moaning/quitting because they didn't get the limited spot.

 

[MattS93 2,155]

1 hour ago, Deranger79 said:

 

Which is just a Snowflake issue really.

 

100% accurate statement.

 

1 hour ago, Deranger79 said:

Really, what do people want here? For them personally to be top BR most matches?

 

That is what it sounds like to me.

 

1 hour ago, Deranger79 said:

For all matches to be one BR?

 

 

I don't think people really realize how stale these matches would get. 

 

 

[MrDane 62]

2 hours ago, Deranger79 said:

 

Which is just a Snowflake issue really.

 

Beyond compression issues the uptier situation is part and parcel of WT and every match to be one BR (which is essentially what people seem to be asking for) is a terrible idea.

 

They game has survived 8 years like this with every player aware of the system from day 1. So it isn't really a problem, just people focusing on completely the wrong issue where balance is concerned.

 

Really, what do people want here? For them personally to be top BR most matches? (Cough...snowflake) For all matches to be one BR? (With no thought to how they would effect vehicles BRs and the 10 minute ueye with some dead BRs) Because the complaint about uptiers makes no sense.

 

If you are in the full uptier and can't kill the vehicles on the opposing team in the same uptier situation, with support from vehicles up to a full BR above you, then maybe more practice is needed, or a different outlook from being the only person on the side.

 

Proof in pudding, generally it is the skill/experience of the player (and a big spoonful of luck) that overshadows BR of them in said match. But it seems too many appear to think small and just blame their BR placement (and create some insane conspiracy theories on the way).

 

Full uptier is personal, your team isn't in a full uptier.

, and every match you ever play has pretty much always had this setup, yet so many seem ignorant until some other aspect of the game starts to aggravate. There is no point being full downtier if the rest of the team are moaning/quitting because they didn't get the limited spot.

 

Snowflake? How? Because I unlike you do not want to play a game, where I am basically cannon fodder?  You want to be stand in AI, be my guest, waste your time.

And I am not looking for being top dog, I just want balanced games, those are the fun ones. 

[CoffeeBean100 2,893]

42 minutes ago, MrDane said:

Snowflake? How? Because I unlike you do not want to play a game, where I am basically cannon fodder?  You want to be stand in AI, be my guest, waste your time.

 

It only refers to you if you act as I have typed. It was not directed at you personally. It shows I feel people wanting to be in this game and always be top BR (possibly because not looked deep enough into what they seem to want would entail, if not, say

what you want to happen) then they see themselves as special and unique, aka snowflake.

 

As someone who uses stuff like the AEC II and still get firsts and wins many BRs above 3.0 I know the doom and gloom you put forward is not accurate in the least.

 

42 minutes ago, MrDane said:

And I am not looking for being top dog, I just want balanced games, those are the fun ones. 

 

Every game is the same, what are you taking about? Some are in uptiers, less downtiered. The fun ones involve vehicles 1 BR between each other too. So I think you need to clarify what you mean as you contradict yourself.

 

Maybe it is how you approach the game that gives you this issue. A feeling a lower BR vehicle can't kill the same BR because the match has higher BR vehicles in it. I mean, what does having a +1 BR vehicle on each side do to stop you killing the same BR level vehicle? (Nothing, but I'm all ears to your theory).

 

Not idea on your various playstyles but maybe don't bring heavies in full uptiers or don't stand face to face with every enemy.... The game has so much where BR becomes irrelevant and overall skill/knowledge determine results.

 

I do however understand compression starts kicking in at 6.7+, so this is NOT really about anti-Uptier, but "sort compression".

Edited April 21, 2021 by Deranger79

[xF4LC0NxPUNCHx 3,596]

On 20/04/2021 at 01:43, WolFie90 said:

Wait...
Someone is THAT cheap, to not use the best ammo all the time? 

 

Imagine being concerned about SL 

 

4 hours ago, Deranger79 said:

Really, what do people want here?

 

For someone to hold their hand

[MrDane 62]

16 minutes ago, Deranger79 said:

 

It only refers to you if you act as I have typed. It was not directed at you personally. It shows I feel people wanting to be in this game and always be top BR (possibly because not looked deep enough into what they seem to want would entail, if not, say

what you want to happen) then they see themselves as special and unique, aka snowflake.

 

As someone who uses stuff like the AEC II and still get firsts and wins many BRs above 3.0 I know the doom and gloom you put forward is not accurate in the least.

 

 

Every game is the same, what are you taking about? Some are in uptiers, less downtiered. The fun ones involve vehicles 1 BR between each other too. So I think you need to clarify what you mean as you contradict yourself.

 

Maybe it is how you approach the game that gives you this issue. A feeling a lower BR vehicle can't kill the same BR because the match has higher BR vehicles in it. I mean, what does having a +1 BR vehicle on each side do to stop you killing the same BR level vehicle? (Nothing, but I'm all ears to your theory).

 

Not idea on your various playstyles but maybe don't bring heavies in full uptiers or don't stand face to face with every enemy.... The game has so much where BR becomes irrelevant and overall skill/knowledge determine results.

 

Yes, I to can run around in a scout vehicle in higher BR's and claim success. And we are not talking about one or two higher tier tanks, it is when most of the enemy team is up there. I like to play the objective, which means you have to get to them, I do not want to have to sneak around or hide in a bush far away, so uptiers, limits me, so I dont play them. 

Players of this game are weird, you have no problem with, not being able to pick the game mode you play, not being able to pick the map that fits your lineup and just accepting the fact that you get thrown into uptier battles. It is just weird.

[[email protected] 1,771]

The vast majority of vehicles can perform just fine in a full uptier. Claiming to be "cannon fodder" or similar is simply a defeatist attitude, which will only lead to more unhappiness and frustration.

 

Giving up and not putting in an honest effort makes you a bad teammate, and a significant contributor to your team's losses, regardless of whether you're top or bottom BR in a match.

[WolFie90 491]

5 hours ago, xF4LC0NxPUNCHx said:

Imagine being concerned about SL

One could argue, that using better ammo, brings more SL... but hey.

[Z3r0_ 4,126]

On 20/04/2021 at 12:41, Rheniaa said:

 

According to Devs no, repair costs has nothing to do with premium status.

(Harrier GR1, Somua SM, Hornet Mk1, Attacker FB2, FW190, just to name a few)

 

They're cheaper in practice because they make more lions.  You really have to try in order to lose money with a premium vehicle.

[xF4LC0NxPUNCHx 3,596]

21 hours ago, MrDane said:

Players of this game are weird, you have no problem with, not being able to pick the game mode you play, not being able to pick the map that fits your lineup and just accepting the fact that you get thrown into uptier battles. It is just weird.

 

Accepting the fact that not everything in life is easy mode does not make someone "weird." Many people actually enjoy a challenge, in fact.

 

In regard to lineups, don't try to pick and choose maps that suite your lineup, rather, build your lineup such that it can accommodate whatever maps are thrown at it.

 

18 hours ago, WolFie90 said:

One could argue, that using better ammo, brings more SL... but hey.

 

Beats me, to be honest. I never look at repair costs, I never look at ammo costs, I just play. Auto repair and auto ammo refill have been enabled since basically my first day playing the game. I'll throw vehicles into a match until I can't any more, efficiency be damned. I buy everything I research immediately, and usually crew it right away, too, even if I have no intentions of ever playing it. Not one single time since I started playing this game in 2013 has SL been a problem, and that includes playing the first ~5 years without a premium account and without premium vehicles. Hell, I'm not even that good (check my stats) and yet my SL account has 9 figures. People that are in a position where they are "broke" in regard to SL are doing something severely wrong, or are restricting themselves to only playing those vehicles that are the most difficult to be net positive with.

 

[WolFie90 491]

5 hours ago, xF4LC0NxPUNCHx said:

Not one single time since I started playing this game in 2013 has SL been a problem

We're pretty much on same boat. 
Exept that my SL is 10 figures

Yes, i don't play B-29 as often as i would like to. But that's pretty much only thing i don't play because of idiotic repairbills

[xF4LC0NxPUNCHx 3,596]

2 hours ago, WolFie90 said:

We're pretty much on same boat. 
Exept that my SL is 10 figures

 

That's my whole point, though. It's so easy to make SL in this game, you don't even have to be some super-duper player. Unless you specifically play nothing but things like the B-29 or whatever top-tier tank is currently super expensive, SL should never ever be an issue. I sincerely wish there was a way to gift SL to other players because I have no idea what I'm supposed to spend all of it on.

[Despeao 947]

25 minutes ago, xF4LC0NxPUNCHx said:

That's my whole point, though. It's so easy to make SL in this game, you don't even have to be some super-duper player. Unless you specifically play nothing but things like the B-29 or whatever top-tier tank is currently super expensive, SL should never ever be an issue. I sincerely wish there was a way to gift SL to other players because I have no idea what I'm supposed to spend all of it on.

That's because players insist on rushing tiers despite veterans like ourselves telling them not to. When you don't know the game, have no viable line ups, can't use the maps to your advantage and can't counter enemy vehicles, it's easy to be on the verge of going broke. When you play a vehicle you enjoy and have a viable line up, it's easy to make SL. I think I made some 8 million SL with the captured P-47 alone and it's a very cheap premium plane.

Players get frustrated and then look for something to blame. I'm one of those that never ever worried about repair costs, ammo or whatever.

For those struggling with SL, buy the Season Pass, it literally throws SL at you.

 

[CoffeeBean100 2,893]

Actually there is a divide years ago between the bank balances (SL) of players.

 

It's a case of everyone is a bit right, depending on their own timing of the game.

 

I know when I joined there were ways (through legitimate play) of earning massive amounts of SL, especially if you were ahead of the curve (never been, they kept adding more and I just gave up on it, which is why I feel sorry for those rushing to the top as the journey is even longer than when I thought "sod it"). I can't remember the ways, might have been in certain Air battles, but these methods generally got closed down to some degree. There have also been multiple changes by Gaijin in how to burn through SL, like some previous ammo costs and the like.

 

So whilst the reason why a lot seem to get the SL issue can be due to rushing and expecting everything for little commitment (think of those who have plonked 8 years and 30k+ battles, they did the "work"), some older players hit the right parts of the game at the right time and benefited by being about to collect 10s of millions of SL. Also, longer term players already bought a lot of the vehicles so most SL is just for building up, due to not rushing because they have been doing it for 8 or so years (say 5 avg) and it's hard to relay that to the players joining in the last year or so who play TT already whilst I still sit around 6.0 (with some nations ready to try up to 9.0ish) after quite a few years (with so many vehicles to choose from that sometimes this choice makes it difficult to decide what to do in a session).

 

I think one point the OP does highlight is that by 6.7+ the potential earnings in GFRB weaken in comparison to previous tiers, generally in regards to repair cost and ammo costs. But this is the pyramid effect of the game, the higher you rise in BR the more the Devs are saying "you like this, you pay for it now" for the average player. The problem might be that there are so many f2p players never putting in anything but time to fill the queue, and that Gaijin might be overly greedy (who really knows? I don't know either way really because it's all guesswork), that even someone investing in the game meets the average earnings but much higher rep costs of the upper section of the BRs. So it will be even more a challenge for the uptier. But possibly that's because people treat it like a spreadsheet and not a game they should be playing to play, not to grind to some utopian point at the top BR that has and never will really exist (it's the same game as 1.0 but with some bells and whistles using different pixel arrangements).