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Will top tier RB become fun ever again?


I will not lie. I am extremely frustrated about top tier RB's current status. The stock grind for new tanks is awful (especially if you are fighting against Russian tanks, which happen to be covered in ERA bricks), the maps are showing their age with the new meta tanks and toxic gameplay is rewarded instead of punished.

Matchmaking is unfairly unbalanced as well. Why should I, as Japan, fight against Germany and USSR together, with the best tanks of the game and extremely good helicopters (USSR, take a look at what a skilled player with a Mi-28 can do at the BEGINNING of a match)? Add in the occasional Sweden, with their amazing IFVs and light tanks to not say they're handheld.

Many of the maps in top tier are too small for modern tanks, and in most cases they're horribly balanced as well. Take a look at Berlin, where if you get the northen spawn you basically have a way to snipe whoever you want from the other spawn (I have to admit I do it as well). Or enemy helicopters spawning BEHIND yourself at the beginning of a match, giving you little to no chance to cover if the pilot knows what he's doing.

Add the silver lions gains as well, which are extremely poor.

Top tier should be the ultimate experience and the reward for having played the game so long, not an incentive to abandon it and go back at lower BRs.

Edited by _Yukari__Akiyama
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  • _Yukari__Akiyama changed the title to Will top tier RB become fun ever again?
59 minutes ago, _Yukari__Akiyama said:

Top tier should be the ultimate experience and the reward for having played the game so long, not an incentive to abandon it and go back at lower BRs.

 

Should it? Sounds like quite a flawed system to search for.

 

I think this comes from some unreasoned expectation that the "top" should be the best. Fortunately that I'd not true to a lot of things.

 

Play what you like, if the current TT is then it is a shame as the game was not built around the modern era, or even expecting it to appear later on (6.7ish was TT when I started, already got there so don't see a reason the have to climb any higher).

 

Very much opinion over the reality I suppose.

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2 hours ago, Deranger79 said:

 

Should it? Sounds like quite a flawed system to search for.

 

I think this comes from some unreasoned expectation that the "top" should be the best. Fortunately that I'd not true to a lot of things.

 

Play what you like, if the current TT is then it is a shame as the game was not built around the modern era, or even expecting it to appear later on (6.7ish was TT when I started, already got there so don't see a reason the have to climb any higher).

 

Very much opinion over the reality I suppose.

 

It's perfectly reasonable in any functional marketplace for the customer to desire/expect that the quality of something be commensurate with the degree of investment (in this case either buying the product with money or being the product by playing for free) required to obtain it.

 

Unfortunately, this isn't a functional marketplace, it's The Hunger Games. That's not the OP's fault and there's no need to talk to him like he is some kind of dope for having standards. 

 

To the OP: you are not wrong about Top Tier. It is the culmination of a system designed to abuse people (more accurately put them in a position to abuse each other) just to the point where enough of them will pay up but all of them won't leave.

 

I doubt this will ever fundamentally change, so I recommend "Sticking it to the Man" by playing some part of the game that you actually enjoy as an alternative particularly to paying money to ease the burden at Top Tier...because they always have more burden waiting for you with each new patch. If the modern Top Tier playstyle is what you actually enjoy notwithstanding its flaws, then by all means go for it but on your own terms. If you feel like you're being painted into a corner to do/play things you don't enjoy then switch it up.

 

This coming from someone who has invested quite a lot into the game (and still supports it financially).

 

Edited by NotTheWave
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3 hours ago, _Yukari__Akiyama said:

I will not lie. I am extremely frustrated about top tier RB's current status. The stock grind for new tanks is awful (especially if you are fighting against Russian tanks, which happen to be covered in ERA bricks), the maps are showing their age with the new meta tanks and toxic gameplay is rewarded instead of punished.

Matchmaking is unfairly unbalanced as well. Why should I, as Japan, fight against Germany and USSR together, with the best tanks of the game and extremely good helicopters (USSR, take a look at what a skilled player with a Mi-28 can do at the BEGINNING of a match)? Add in the occasional Sweden, with their amazing IFVs and light tanks to not say they're handheld.

Many of the maps in top tier are too small for modern tanks, and in most cases they're horribly balanced as well. Take a look at Berlin, where if you get the northen spawn you basically have a way to snipe whoever you want from the other spawn (I have to admit I do it as well). Or enemy helicopters spawning BEHIND yourself at the beginning of a match, giving you little to no chance to cover if the pilot knows what he's doing.

Add the silver lions gains as well, which are extremely poor.

Top tier should be the ultimate experience and the reward for having played the game so long, not an incentive to abandon it and go back at lower BRs.

Sadly this is exactly how they design the game. It's an obsolete and barbaric marketing strategy that centers on frustration and quick cash grab to get their income. It's not like they can't improve top tier gameplay, they can if they really want to but the problem is that they simply just don't want to. If you think of it the players make more effort in suggestions, research etc. than the actual devs in improving the game itself. As long as gaijin gets the monopoly of semi-realistic tank/air gameplay they simply don't have the reason to change their old ways.

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Inherent in the OP's question is the assumption that top tier was fun sometime in the past. I'd be curious to know when that was and what specific changes caused it to become not fun from his perspective.  Because there are many, many things about top tier that people can disagree about.  For example,  helicopters are a hot button topic. You or I may hate helicopters and the effect they have on top tier gameplay, but clearly there are others who enjoy rocket-fueled suicide runs or long-range ATGM sniping of oblivious tanks. Whose fun gets priority?

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1 hour ago, NotTheWave said:

It's perfectly reasonable in any functional marketplace for the customer to desire/expect that the quality of something be commensurate with the degree of investment (in this case either buying the product with money or being the product by playing for free) required to obtain it.

 

Unfortunately, this isn't a functional marketplace, it's The Hunger Games. That's not the OP's fault and there's no need to talk to him like he is some kind of dope for having standards. 

 

Not sure how he would feel some kind of dope from those comments. I think you missed have read something into that a bit too deeply.

 

The point I made is about TT being somehow the pinnacle of the game. And yes, it SHOULD all be workable, and from my view modern/TT just doesn't work in this game with what we have.

 

If you invest thousands of hours it doesn't mean you are aiming for the highest BR vehicles, some do, some don't. So for many there is a lot that works and perfect value for money. If you are truly about investment as worth then it is also down to the investee to work out if something is worth investing that sort of time with. And now, even a couple of years ago, after looking at opinions of each TT era would you say this area is handled well.

 

Fortunately I never chased TT as one of my goals in game, and TT has increased quite a lot that I have overtaken my starting TT position anyway.

 

The OP obviously does feel the "top" is where they want to be, and yes it needs a lot of work, but it isn't the be all and end all.

 

And I am sorry but I do not agree in anyway that "Top tier should be the ultimate experience and the reward for having played the game so long, not an incentive to abandon it and go back at lower BRs." - especially with understanding how the game has moved forward/evolved. I'm sure the OP does not need just 100% agreement.

Edited by Deranger79
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well if ur main goal is to play top BR wheter if its fun or not, go for it.

 

If ur goal is to enjoy, try finding a BR that is fun for u.

 

If u enjoy abrams, t90s, and leopards, then its gonna be top tier and all its issues.

 

my sweet spot is 3.3-5 7 BR.  i have tanks up to 8.3 BR but rarely play them.

 

of course it would be nice if top br was enjoyable. but if u feel frustrated all the time i suggest trying some lower BR.

 

 

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On 03/03/2021 at 09:52, Corona_Chan69 said:

It's an obsolete and barbaric marketing strategy that centers on frustration and quick cash grab to get their income.

The only reason to pay for anything in the world is out of frustration with not having it.  Nothing different is happening here.

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On 03/03/2021 at 16:52, [email protected] said:

tiny maps were annoying but the addition of dying servers has made it borderline unplayable

Agreed. The last few weeks have been absolutely horrible for me. Especially in the evening or during night. 

PL up to 20%, people unable to respawn, move, shoot or just stuck doing the eagle death spiral... 

 

Edited by MagicalMethod
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Even if top tier issues were fixed it still wouldn't be as fun for most people. It would be a snipe/camp fest. At least it would be slightly more realistic though...

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9 hours ago, Sertica said:

The only reason to pay for anything in the world is out of frustration with not having it.  Nothing different is happening here.

Sure, but there are both positive reinforcement (addition of a good/pleasurable thing) and negative reinforcement (removal of a bad/painful thing) that can be used when trying to influence behavior.

 

I don't presume to know what the right mixture is between the two for a F2P title, but it seems the higher you go in BR the more reliant on negative reinforcement the game becomes. 

 

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1 hour ago, PointyPuffin said:

Was there any point in the history of War Thunder at which top tier was nearly as enjoyable as anything below it?

Top tier was always better than low tier

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9 minutes ago, Ymir2k said:

Top tier was always better than low tier

 

OK superstar gamer/pinball wizard/toonp0rn avatar guy...you can absolutely have all of it then!

 

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The placement of helicopter bases is sometimes a bit iffy. On some maps the heliports are aready in flanking position and on at least one map its almost behind the enemy spawn. Thats actually true. Could be improved. There are really alot issues with map design....

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Well the stock Grind in Top Tier is really just a pain i agree especially when as you said you are starting with HeatFS rounds which are almost obsolete in that BR range.

That paired with the massive RP requiredments for even a single module make the Grind really painful.

 

The maps yes are 100% outdated and way too small for Vehicles with the potential to knock each other out over 2km+ 

But there two are multiple factors that work with it.

-First of all the Optics arent high res and far ranging enough,if you make maps that large to show off the realistic capabilities of these tanks then its a pixel hunt.

-Second a large amount of the Playerbase actually prefer the smaller maps as they are more action packed and large maps usually result in death out of nowhere due to bad design.

 

As for Nation Balance to put it simply you just cannot fully balance it out as some Nations spent more on Military equipment then other and or have other priorities and doctrines.

Gameplaywise you could dip into fictional Vehicles or Blueprint tech but thats always going to be a tough spot.

 

Japan is a prime example as an Island Nation they are more concentrated on Coastal Defense (Navy and Airfoce) rather then Army that and the restriction Imposed to their Military kinda doesnt leave a lot of Room.

 

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8 minutes ago, Ymir2k said:

Playing low tier when you have top tier is what all losers do 

 

In the words of Master Yoda..."When fifty years old you are, game as well will you?"

 

We'll see.

 

In the meantime I'll play whatever tier I like (including top tier sometimes) and you can think whatever you want about it.

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I dont think anything, its just that top tier is better in every way 

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19 minutes ago, Ymir2k said:

Playing low tier when you have top tier is what all losers do 

Sure because after you unlock toptier with one nation, you can immediatly skip the lowtier grind for all the other nations, for free.

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1 minute ago, Hartwiekruppstah said:

Sure because after you unlock toptier with one nation, you can immediatly skip the lowtier grind for all the other nations, for free.

I said when you have top tier lemao 

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16 minutes ago, Ymir2k said:

I dont think anything, its just that top tier is better in every way 

 

"ok"

Edited by NotTheWave
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4 minutes ago, Ymir2k said:

I said when you have top tier lemao 

That reads more like "when you have unlocked toptier for any nation" besides that is lowtier part of the game, everyone can play. Some people, believe it or not, like tanks like the M22 have fun playing lowtier(i personally despise it since i started grinding japan).

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Anything above 6.7 does not exist, this way the game is wonderful, after finishing Germany WWII vehicles I will switch to some other nation.

 

From me there is no money to be made for Gaijin past WWII.

Edited by NSallaNuto
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8 minutes ago, Hartwiekruppstah said:

besides that is lowtier part of the game, everyone can play. Some people, believe it or not, like tanks like the M22 have fun playing lowtier(i personally despise it since i started grinding japan).

 

Nope, the Internet has spoken, you must get in line. Try-harding is the only option!!1!

 

Next we go down to the ice cream shop and tell people that they are losers if they like vanilla better than chocolate, lol.

 

This forum is always good for a laugh in the morning.

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