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Why did they remove the HVAP belts from the Ho. 229? I know it was a long time ago, and they added a ground attack belt with 1/4 being a HVAP round but it's way worse than the Me 262 A-1a/U1 that gets full HVAP belts on its 2x MK 108 cannons. They are also way more accurate than the Ho. 229's MK 103 cannons.

 

Was it that broken in the first place? I didn't own the Horten back then, but I have the premium Do 335 B-2 that has 3x MK103 cannons with full HVAP belts. It's 1.6 BR lower so I don't get why the Horten wouldn't be balanced with full HVAP belts or is Do 335 B-2 completely broken? Doesn't seem like that.

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37 minutes ago, Naiveca said:

Was it that broken in the first place? 

 

There was a time when the Hortons caused Air RB matches to end very quickly. You'd have a group of 229's annihilate medium tanks and other hard ground targets in a matter of minutes causing the game to end. From what I understand they were pretty deadly in Ground RB, too. I didn't play tanks at that time so I don't know about that for sure.

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1 minute ago, xF4LC0NxPUNCHx said:

 

There was a time when the Hortons caused Air RB matches to end very quickly. You'd have a group of 229's annihilate medium tanks and other hard ground targets in a matter of minutes causing the game to end. From what I understand they were pretty deadly in Ground RB, too. I didn't play tanks at that time so I don't know about that for sure.

 

And how about today? U1 is already able do to the same if it is still possible, probably not. I think giving the HVAP back to the Ho. 229 wouldn't do much to the balance, instead it would just give a reason to use the Horten as a ground pounder instead of just playing it for the looks. It's a poor fighter plane as it stands. Doing CAS is already really difficult when you get upped against M163 with radar.

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The ruined air RB and ground RB for quite a while so got hit with the nerf hammer, really should have the old engines too so it is not all bad.

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On 02/03/2021 at 15:19, Naiveca said:

 

And how about today? U1 is already able do to the same if it is still possible, probably not. I think giving the HVAP back to the Ho. 229 wouldn't do much to the balance, instead it would just give a reason to use the Horten as a ground pounder instead of just playing it for the looks. It's a poor fighter plane as it stands. Doing CAS is already really difficult when you get upped against M163 with radar.

Well isn't it often said that US teams get crippled by the amount of people playing bombers and groundpounders ? Wouldn't it then be an improvement for the overall balance if germany is as effective as america in terms groundpounding(atleast in air rb)? Though tbh, due to planes like the F89D and A2D and the 262 being kinda **** against superprops, axis aren't really doing that great at 7.3. The Horten is one of the few planes there really that is still shining.

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Giving the Ho229 full HVAP belts would not really give Germany a new capability, plenty other planes already can do that (262, 110, 410, all 335s, 152). By using those the plane would be far less effective vs air, so pilots would have to choose carefully.

 

I don't see a reason to not give the Horten HVAP belts, it would really not shift game balance.

 

BTW, it a plane I don't fly, handling is too strange, Tiger IIs have better roll capability.... belts would not change this. I would like they could make its fly model less "extreme", it is not like they have based it on real data anyway, just (educated) assumptions about a flying wing behaviour.

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6 minutes ago, NSallaNuto said:

Giving the Ho229 full HVAP belts would not really give Germany a new capability, plenty other planes already can do that (262, 110, 410, all 335s, 152). By using those the plane would be far less effective vs air, so pilots would have to choose carefully.

 

I don't see a reason to not give the Horten HVAP belts, it would really not shift game balance.

 

BTW, it a plane I don't fly, handling is too strange, Tiger IIs have better roll capability.... belts would not change this. I would like they could make its fly model less "extreme", it is not like they have based it on real data anyway, just (educated) assumptions about a flying wing behaviour.

i miss flying the ho229 at ground RB,

 that's where it only does best, they really need to give it full HVAP belt and the same could be done to the kugelblitzkrieg

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On 02/03/2021 at 22:11, xF4LC0NxPUNCHx said:

 

There was a time when the Hortons caused Air RB matches to end very quickly. You'd have a group of 229's annihilate medium tanks and other hard ground targets in a matter of minutes causing the game to end.

now we have A-7Ds running with 3 anti-tank cannons, doing exactly the same but this time even faster because of their airspawn and the fact that most of their ground targets are light pillboxes. there's no excuse to not give the 229 its full AP belt

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25 minutes ago, piscessoedroen said:

there's no excuse to not give the 229 its full AP belt

What about the accuracy nerf that conveniently got applied to the He 219 and some other MK 103 planes too :lol2:

Edited by NoodleCup31
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2 hours ago, piscessoedroen said:

now we have A-7Ds running with 3 anti-tank cannons, doing exactly the same but this time even faster because of their airspawn and the fact that most of their ground targets are light pillboxes. there's no excuse to not give the 229 its full AP belt

the thing is a-7d is an usa plane and ho 229 is german and we all know usa suffer and bad german bias rule all br with near 100% win rate

i remember the time ho 229 was good and 7.0 but ripped at any turn above 500km/h so you had to slow down to disengage

 

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On 05/03/2021 at 09:30, NoodleCup31 said:

What about the accuracy nerf that conveniently got applied to the He 219 and some other MK 103 planes too :lol2:

 

That is a different issue, I could not like it but I can understand it for balance reasons, the  missing HVAP belt makes no sense to me, a lot of other planes have those (note, never used a Ho229).

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On 06/03/2021 at 12:07, NSallaNuto said:

 

That is a different issue, I could not like it but I can understand it for balance reasons, the  missing HVAP belt makes no sense to me, a lot of other planes have those (note, never used a Ho229).

its all thanks to crying usa mains who simply cannot stand if any other nation beside usa can cas

good example fj-4b with 5 bullpup agm, its perfectly fine but when ger use g.91 with 4 nord, what is basicly the same as usa agm its instantly overpowered and need nerf+uptier while usa has 2 very capable spaa and many fighters to counter them (the complains on rus side i can understand, shilka is almost the weakest of all 8.0-8.3 spaa), then rus gets mouse guided agm for yak-38 and mig-21pfm so next update usa will get fire and forget agm for a-7d becouse they need it

Edited by TheKatyusHATman
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On 06/03/2021 at 08:29, TheKatyusHATman said:

its all thanks to crying usa mains who simply cannot stand if any other nation beside usa can cas

good example fj-6b with 5 bullpup (or bullpop i dont know) agm, its perfectly fine but when ger use g.91 with 4 nord, what is basicly the same as usa agm its instantly overpowered and need nerf+uptier

 

One of those is a one time only Rank 6 premium which was gated behind one of everyone's favorite grind events and currently costs $320 to purchase on the market. The other is a Rank 5 tech tree plane which anyone with enough patience can get. The G.91 is also supported by what is arguably one of the best (and most meta) lineups in the entire game, while the FJ-4 has a bunch of woefully outclassed tanks that could hardly fit the Ground RB meta less well if they tried.

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On 08/03/2021 at 03:28, Dianeces said:

 

One of those is a one time only Rank 6 premium which was gated behind one of everyone's favorite grind events and currently costs $320 to purchase on the market. The other is a Rank 5 tech tree plane which anyone with enough patience can get. The G.91 is also supported by what is arguably one of the best (and most meta) lineups in the entire game, while the FJ-4 has a bunch of woefully outclassed tanks that could hardly fit the Ground RB meta less well if they tried.

oh please dont play the victim card

and fine fj-4b isnt count but still a-4b has 3 agm what is a good number too, not to mention all the bombs loadouts what every usa fighter have

and yes ger 8.7 is pretty good you still can counter them with what usa has at 8.7 and lower, but if you have problem with usa then what rus 8.7 can say? they only have armor advantage against apds and heat-fs while having worse gun handling and slower reload speed, also no air support so every other nation outclass them while being "better"

Edited by TheKatyusHATman
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HO229 was never dominant. It was good, but better AA were coming out about the same time it was strong and were making it less and less relevant. It was rare to see one get more than 2 or 3 kills in a game. 

HO 229 was nerfed 3 times. 

HVAP belts were nerfed 
MK103 accuracy  was majorly nerfed.
Wing rip at 650kph


Wing rip was again changed to be a bit more lenient, but its still there. Belts need to be reverted at a minimum, and still the plane won't be very strong. 
 

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28 minutes ago, Zephoid said:

HO229 was never dominant. It was good, but better AA were coming out about the same time it was strong and were making it less and less relevant. It was rare to see one get more than 2 or 3 kills in a game. 
 

the only nation that have get betters aa in low tier is germany, the others keep using the same useless ****, so it didnt become less relevant because of the aa, just the germans payers want to kill 4 tanks in one run 

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The common theme seems to be ... "if it is new, then it will be OP so we can make money off GE sales." A7D is no different than any other OP vehicle they have added to this game. If you think gaijin favors any nation, you are right. They favor the nations that make them money ... aka ... US, Germany and Russia. Ho 229's time has come to an end. Simple as that. HVAP would still be very powerful on a jet of that caliber at 7.3 BR range given there isn't much CAS at that BR currently that has the ability to gun down multiple targets quickly like the ho229 used to and still can. Just don't see it out as much because of the newer mk 103 carriers out there.

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14 minutes ago, piscessoedroen said:

this plane is 7.3

how many aa are in 7.3?  only one nation have a competent aa below 8.0 without taking into acount germany 

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1 hour ago, SrNowel59917 said:

the only nation that have get betters aa in low tier is germany, the others keep using the same useless ****, so it didnt become less relevant because of the aa, just the germans payers want to kill 4 tanks in one run 

7.3 isn't low teir. 

The R3 is still the best lower teir AA by almost any metric. 

7.7 has the falcon, which has no difficulty with the 229 and is quite good vs tanks. 8.0 every nation has an AA that easily engage the 229

Killing 4 tanks in a game takes a LOT of skill. You don't have a tail, so you can't adjust your yaw to your target. Not only that, you have to come in at a low angle due to your speed and wing rip, so you are hitting side armor rather than top. Mk103 have a good amount of pen, but if you are firing at 800m, the side armor of many turrets is going to deflect shots and tracks will eat them all day long. Killing with WW2 cannons often is going to take multiple passes. 
 

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1 hour ago, omnipotank said:

The common theme seems to be ... "if it is new, then it will be OP so we can make money off GE sales." A7D is no different than any other OP vehicle they have added to this game

hmmm, no different than any other vehicle, thats why it will get fire and forget AGM like any other nation, and dont come with ger has fire and forget for tiger heli or ka-50/52 has vihkr, in my 15-20 battles with leo2a4 and leo2k at 10.7 (just recently unlocked them, still had 4-5 kills with stock tanks in many battles) i never saw any "overpowered" helis, cas planes still more common

 

back to the point if a ho 229 managed to get 4-5 kills they deserve it and the opposing team is full of idiots for not bring any plane to counter it

ho 229 is probably the easiest target when its engage ground targets, its a huge target, bleed speed at turns like no other, roll rate is garbage and

 only can rely on its guns, what are terrible now, a p-47 is more of a threat than a ho 229 becouse its kill more quickly and ready to engage fighters with loads of speed

1 hour ago, omnipotank said:

If you think gaijin favors any nation, you are right. They favor the nations that make them money ... aka ... USA, germany and Russia

good joke, gaijin can make money from every nation,every new nation bring loads of money becouse of the hype

and gaijin favour only 1 nation, and its usa, just let me show some examples:

105mm sherman at 2.7, bradley at 8.0, m48 at 7.3, m50, m56, t114, t92 at 6.7, a-7d at 9.7, av-8 at 9.3

i do agree germany has many handycaps too but many of them are completly negated by usa, and rus is the least favoured nation of the mains, just look up for its win rate and compare it to usa and germany

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