Jump to content

Simplified profit/earning system in EC missions


Best answer

Thank you for all your feedback! Your suggestions and ideas were passed to the development team. They will continue to work on it and when ready, we will again share any news with you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, SaratogaCV60 said:

4, The player’s location is not display on the map (T-4-1 and T-4-2, etc. only display the square where they are located, not the specific location), and aircraft without a navigation system must use landmarks to determine their exact location. An aircraft with a navigation system can see its position through the onboard display.

lol no :D

Have fun on Sinai with your WWII plane then.

 

More bases to make them more the main target is a good point though. Yesterday in an Air SB EC match on Sinai I got accused of airfield strafing because I attacked an airfield because the only base on the map was right next to it and I had bombs left over. Waiting for bases to respawn is the norm. Just reduce the respawn cooldown and maybe add more bases to avoid multiple bombers bombing the same base.

  • Thanks 1
  • Upvote 2
medal medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, TinyTinkerTank said:

lol no :D

Have fun on Sinai with your WWII plane then.

 

More bases to make them more the main target is a good point though. Yesterday in an Air SB EC match on Sinai I got accused of airfield strafing because I attacked an airfield because the only base on the map was right next to it and I had bombs left over. Waiting for bases to respawn is the norm. Just reduce the respawn cooldown and maybe add more bases to avoid multiple bombers bombing the same base.

 

Yes, this is ridiculous! The number of bases per game has been reduced and then they pop up next to Airfields? :D

  • Upvote 1
medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Ouiche said:

Fighters_855f9ae8fa9945e9bf3125116182481

 

EC missions (all of them) differ from other game modes because of their duration (session time), respawns and game room (lobby) mechanics. 

The extended duration of the mission and low concentration of gameplay actions results in a large reward for each individual action. The system of multiple respawns is implemented through a ‘cost’ for each fly out and not vehicle loss. Both of these points make the economy system noticeably more difficult to set up and understand for players - a player when respawning in a vehicle initially has a shortage of game currency and then has to do without reward for a lengthy period in search of a suitable target.

At the same time, game room/lobby mechanics can be used by dishonest players to create ‘rigged’ battles where they can repeatedly destroy the same cooperating enemy and as the actual destruction of that enemy is a fairly infrequent event in EC, the reward for it is set high.

To solve this issue, we are considering options to simplify the economy system in EC missions by adding a fixed amount of SL and RP per time period when reaching a specific event in the mission (not taking into account time on the airfield - a more detailed description will be published separately) instead of a reward for each individual action. However, the bonus reward for winning a mission and the half reward for returning to an airfield would remain unchanged. The average level of reward over time in switching to the new system would remain unchanged and will correspond to reward received by players in other game modes.

These proposed changes are intended to help honest players to choose mission objectives based on personal interest rather than possible profit. It should negate the opportunity for dishonest players to use this game mode for their own selfish purposes.

Don't hesitate to leave your feedback!

 

 

Uh, there’s two types of players in Sim

1) A Skilled Player who is attempting to make SL, 

2) A complete Ace who is trying out the mode

 

Enduring Confrontation, correct me if I’m wrong, only appears in Helicopter Battles, or Air Simulator

Helicopter Battles are abused the hell out of, last time I played I spawned about 3 times and got slaughtered by Ka-50s and AH-64s the moment I spawned.

Air Simulator is just a SL grinding game.

 

The lack of actual detail (to me at least) makes it tricky to clear up what’s going on, but to my understanding

You are reducing rewards for a Kill on another player, and increasing rewards for flying around. 
We don’t all have 12 hours a day to spare lol (although I suspect I’m being a bit unfair to Gaijin here), but playing EC is tricky as it is (Helicopters appear at Tier 5 for everyone except China and Sweden, and Air Sim basically requires HOTAS)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, PGNoob said:

"To solve this issue, we are considering options to simplify the economy system in EC missions by adding a fixed amount of SL and RP per time period when reaching a specific event in the mission (not taking into account time on the airfield - a more detailed description will be published separately) instead of a reward for each individual action."

So if I go after fighters, shoot down bombers and spy planes I get punished because I "hit the RP and SL cap"

"These proposed changes are intended to help honest players to choose mission objectives based on personal interest rather than possible profit. It should negate the opportunity for dishonest players to use this game mode for their own selfish purposes."

You are LITERALLY PUNISHING BOTH HONEST AND "DISHONEST" players at the same time by implementing this. Doesnt help the fact that these "Dishonest" players are the cause as to WHY the repair costs are so ASTRONOMICALLY HIGH on Top Tier SIM. If you want to cut our rewards in half because of some people drop $100 to get their ez grind (and actually make money off that btw) then at least have the DECENCY of lowering the repair costs of high tier jets across ALL nations first.

It annoys me so much that they use the term “Dishonest” and “Honest” in this. The line gets blurred easily, as “Honest” players want to not go bankrupt

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, TinyTinkerTank said:

Dude chill out and git gut. Mouse players should also be welcome in this mode. This mode should not only be for those with some crazy 1500€ HOTAS setup. One can play with a mouse pretty fine with enough training, including dogfights.

Mouse players are welcome, and they never haven’t been. It’s just a lot harder to play with mouse. Bearing in mind not everyone can spend lots of money (a basic Joystick costs around £20-£30, that’s reasonably decent), F2P players will suffer without the equipment. Unlike Ground, Air Sim is a lot harder with Mouse + Keyboard than the RB/AB counterparts.

1 hour ago, PointyPuffin said:

Does that mean that a Ka-50 in heli EC will now earn the same as a Mi-4? (+ premium multiplier perhaps) 

Haha, that’s if the Mi-4 doesn’t get shot down by anyone 20 seconds after they spawn. Last time I played Heli EC I got shot down by a Ka-50, an AH-64 and the like, sniping away with their Stingers, Atakas, R-60s, Vikhrs and so on.

Helicopters in their entirety would have to change for Heli EC to work

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sim main here.

 

This is ridiculous. You want to take away the reward for kills and make it time-dependent? So if I log in for 20 minutes cause that's all I have, rack up an ace because I've spent 8 years in War Thunder honing my skills to a point where I can do that in sim, I'll get nothing? This is egregious.

 

NO ONE, literally NO ONE in Sim EC thinks that kills are over-rewarded. Absolutely no one. Players with low skill levels enter sim to bomb for their RP/SL, not kill. The few people who make custom lobbies are the only people you need to punish, and the easy way to do that it to stop letting people take reserve planes into EC6-7, OR take out custom lobbies altogether. OR just actually moderate and ban their accounts individually.

 

Custom lobbies are awful anyway, they're always either every country against every country, which is ridiculous in a game mode you need to visually ID everything, or every country against one, so they can be stacked. They were a nice idea, poorly executed.

If you take kill rewards away, the move would kill what is left of the EC community. There is a huge level of pride and stock placed on mastery of BFM and proficiency in air sim, as should be the case in a COMBAT AIR SIMULATOR. If killing a community you don't really care about is your intention, then go nuts.

There's a lot of things you could do to improve Enduring Confrontation. THIS IS NOT IT.

  • Thanks 2
  • Upvote 9
medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, TinyTinkerTank said:

Dude chill out and git gut. Mouse players should also be welcome in this mode. This mode should not only be for those with some crazy 1500€ HOTAS setup. One can play with a mouse pretty fine with enough training, including dogfights.

 

we need to differentiate here. nobody is agains players using mouse joy... mouse aim on the other hand....

 

1 minute ago, TigrisJK said:

Sim main here.

 

This is ridiculous. You want to take away the reward for kills and make it time-dependent? So if I log in for 20 minutes cause that's all I have, rack up an ace because I've spent 8 years in War Thunder honing my skills to a point where I can do that in sim, I'll get nothing? This is egregious.

 

NO ONE, literally NO ONE in Sim EC thinks that kills are over-rewarded. Absolutely no one. Players with low skill levels enter sim to bomb for their RP/SL, not kill. The few people who make custom lobbies are the only people you need to punish, and the easy way to do that it to stop letting people take reserve planes into EC6-7, OR take out custom lobbies altogether. OR just actually moderate and ban their accounts individually.

 

Well Bomber/Mouse Aim abusers need punishment too.

 

 

6 minutes ago, Firestarter__ said:

Mouse players are welcome, and they never haven’t been.

 

Mouse joy player have benn welcome from day one, noone ever looked down on them. 

 

6 minutes ago, Firestarter__ said:

It’s just a lot harder to play with mouse. Bearing in mind not everyone can spend lots of money (a basic Joystick costs around £20-£30, that’s reasonably decent), F2P players will suffer without the equipment. Unlike Ground, Air Sim is a lot harder with Mouse + Keyboard than the RB/AB counterparts.

 

not necessarily true. mouse and keyboard can be a lot easier than joystick if you use planes that allow for mouse aim. Again mouse joy =/= Mouse aim... we really need to differentiate here.

 

 

  • Confused 1
medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Honestly I'm quite confused about the OP. Here is my small piece about what is wrong with the economy and a couple other things in EC. After all it is close to being a very good game mode!

 

1) I seem to make adequate rp (for the time spent) but absolutely no SL. I can play for 2 hourss and make like 100k SL which is nothing for the time put in.

2) Often one team was a lot more player controlled vehicles than another and thus its unfair if the results are based on team earnings as the team with more players almost always wins because the players respawn unlike a lot of the bot players and they are also much better at fighting and completing the tasks. Make team balance better please. 

3) Just stop player created rooms from making dumb line ups. I always see USSR and GB vs USA and stuff like come on have some historical accuracy please. Phantoms shouldnt fiight phantoms and migs shouldnt fight migs. Maybe have preset lineups like:

UK, USA, West Germany, France, Japan vs USSR, China, East Germany etc

 

PLEASE SPLIT GERMAN TREE INTO EAST AND WEST GERMANY!

When MiG21-MF and F86K come at you in your american jet its so hard to tell friend from foe at decent distance and is very frustrating when the SL penalty for a team kill is so high (50k sl for me which is more than i make in an hour in EC atm). 

Also please fix AI planes being the wrong nation.

Fighting in a phantom defending IL-28 bombers from MiG attacks seems just wrong

 

 

  • Thanks 1
  • Confused 1
  • Upvote 2
medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For me, the best changes would be removing player made matches and leveling the reward for if you win or lose, it's really annoying when you play the full match, score higher than any other player in the match, but still get an awful reward because your entire team bailed after half an hour and no one replaced them (this is also half the reason you see the same player being killed over and over). SB also needs it's own gunner mechanics, since the super accurate point and click style we have now makes some planes far too difficult to approach, I personally feel that increasing the weapon's spread may help with this, as skilled players will no longer get instant head shots on pilots that are a kilometre away, while new players will benefit from the odd hit given by the increased area that their shots are occupying.

 

Also, the bot's need to be something more than XP Piñatas for the enemy team, since they just fly round in circles doing nothing useful towards objectives 

 

Edited by Joeythesheep
  • Like 3
  • Confused 1
  • Upvote 1
medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

First, let me say that Realistic Battle Enduring Confrontation needs to happen more often.  Naval RB EC and Air RB EC are some of the most fun that can be had in this game.  A Ground RB EC would be fabulous as well.

 

Naval RB EC:  You generally make too little SL and too little RP compared to an equal TOTAL time invested in Naval RB Random Battles (including time in queue) let alone actual game time (time in battle).  The rewards should be higher.  I know you spend more time sailing around quietly in that mode, but there has to be a way to reward that to a degree.  I also submit that abuse in Naval EC is fairly rare.

 

Helo EC:  This mode needs fixes from top to bottom.  However, in response to the Original Post, it routinely suffers abuse by people feeding kills to a friend or trading kills with a friend.  It also has a significant problem with Ka-50/52 and the Vikhr missile.  Both of these are helped by moving to a system were the reward for killing enemy players are reduced, as in the Original Post.  I would recommend a more comprehensive AI and a better level of reward for Killing AI.   By a more comprehensive AI I mean more convoys, more random AI occupying towns, and villages and perhaps AI helicopters or aircraft.  The capture points and frontline battles should obviously remain as is.  For a better level of reward this could mean that you lower the reward for killing an opponent by 50% and raise the reward for killing the AI by 50%.  The Original Post is kind of hard to understand but I as I read it It could make people quit sooner if their team is constantly losing objectives.  As they are missing out on substantial rewards.  This being said, I am all for anything that reduces the reward for killing players in Helo EC.

  • Confused 1
medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Joeythesheep said:

For me, the best changes would be removing player made matches and leveling the reward for if you win or lose, it's really annoying when you play the full match, score higher than any other player in the match, but still get an awful reward because your entire team bailed after half an hour and no one replaced them (this is also half the reason you see the same player being killed over and over). SB also needs it's own gunner mechanics, since the super accurate point and click style we have now makes some planes far too difficult to approach, I personally feel that increasing the weapon's spread may help with this, as skilled players will no longer get instant head shots on pilots that are a kilometre away, while new players will benefit from the odd hit given by the increased area that their shots are occupying.

Yes this is true. If i Join a sim game and the team is losing I leave straight away becuase the rewards are so unballanced. Why waste my time playing for an hour If i know my rewards will be halved becuase were oging to lose? Nah. I will leave and join a room which Is going to win instead or just log off.

  • Like 2
medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, SirCapsAlot said:

Yes this is true. If i Join a sim game and the team is losing I leave straight away becuase the rewards are so unballanced. Why waste my time playing for an hour If i know my rewards will be halved becuase were oging to lose? Nah. I will leave and join a room which Is going to win instead or just log off.

 

Normal human behavior. Who wants to stay on a losing team?

medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, ivica70 said:

Who wants to stay on a losing team?

I do. I dont care about the whole reward crap, I just want to fly my planes I like. 

In WT, theres wayyy too much discussion about gains and losses and RPs and SLs and formulas and cost and rewards and so on.
Where is the "I am sitting in my virtual cockpit, engaging in a 3 hour long tactical match with many objectives while improving my flight skill"-mentality?
Do you all have only your friggin balance in mind when firing up sim? Really? 
I mean you cant completely forget about SL etc. since its part of the game, but to me it often feels like people treat this game like they'd treat a share portfolio or something.

Fly for the fun guys not SL, enjoy the planes you have, instead of always wanting the "next toy" (because you cant seem to realize that there will always be the "next toy").

  • Confused 3
  • Upvote 4
medal medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 25/01/2021 at 11:12, Ouiche said:

These proposed changes are intended to help honest players to choose mission objectives based on personal interest rather than possible profit.

 

Edit: actually, assists and destruction of air and ground vehicles, as well as participation in mission objectives, should be more rewarded. at least triple. And the exploit? It will become a lesser problem when SL are not so hard to get and easy to lose. About exploiters for RP, well do yourself some moderation work, go for reports. As someone said to me, block reserve biplanes from entering EC4 onwards, or put a limit on how many kills give RP and SL, like 100 per match. Or use it as honeypot criteria.
 

 

 

Edited by Pinguim01
Reading other comments made me change my mind. I was a little optimist, not anymomre. I agree that the proposed changes might kill the mode.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, Firestarter__ said:

Mouse players are welcome, and they never haven’t been. It’s just a lot harder to play with mouse. Bearing in mind not everyone can spend lots of money (a basic Joystick costs around £20-£30, that’s reasonably decent), F2P players will suffer without the equipment.

Getting a joystick is not a problem for them, they just don't want them, I saw many farmers and mouse joystick players that fly very expensive premium planes and if they can afford for example the AV-8A which costs 60 euro or premium planes for 6000-8000 GE which is like 30-45 euro (this is how much cost planes from EC5-7) then they should be able to afford a cheap joystick too (I use only the T.16000M, the old one) but they don't want to buy it, they just prefer to use SB EC as a game mode where you can get lots of SL and RB by zombering to either research a new plane (you can find lots of them right after a major patch release) or modifications to for example the F-4C.
 

  • Upvote 4
medal medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, RideR2 said:

Getting a joystick is not a problem for them, they just don't want them, I saw many farmers and mouse joystick players that fly very expensive premium planes and if they can afford for example the AV-8A which costs 60 euro or premium planes for 6000-8000 GE which is like 30-45 euro (this is how much cost planes from EC5-7) then they should be able to afford a cheap joystick too (I use only the T.16000M, the old one) but they don't want to buy it, they just prefer to use SB EC as a game mode where you can get lots of SL and RB by zombering to either research a new plane (you can find lots of them right after a major patch release) or modifications to for example the F-4C.
 

 

This! Bad alibi not to have money to buy a stick

medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, ivica70 said:

 

If you mean the player created truce rooms - they are all there to farm in their bombers easily enormous amounts of XPs...

Gaijin's fault for making research so slow and painful in AB/RB without premium

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, DerGrafVonZahl said:

 

 

heard this song and dance before. Back then it was operation mozdok that was used for bomber abuse. Then Gaijin took the Map out of the EC selection but it didn't stop the abuse and neither will deleting player created rooms. All it will achieve is that players won't find battles for the nations they want to play and reduce playernumbers (and i mean actual players not abusers)... just look at SB GF when the even system was introduced, now you can't play the tanks you want to play and people left.

Yes removing Mozlok made a huge hit on the grinders. They had to look for alternative ways to abuse. Coincidence all the alternative abusing ways are happening in Player Created Room? 

 

Now all Gaijin has to do is to remove the problem from its root. 

 

Gaijin can make official rooms you don't need to cry.

 

Removing 50 France vs all room is not being unable to find a good battle, it is being unable to find good room to abuse to grind...

Edited by AdelWolf
  • Confused 1
  • Upvote 1
medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, ivica70 said:

 

This! Bad alibi not to have money to buy a stick

not to mention you can use game controller. everyone on PS and Xbox play like this

medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, SpicysaucedHD said:

I do. I dont care about the whole reward crap, I just want to fly my planes I like. 

In WT, theres wayyy too much discussion about gains and losses and RPs and SLs and formulas and cost and rewards and so on.
Where is the "I am sitting in my virtual cockpit, engaging in a 3 hour long tactical match with many objectives while improving my flight skill"-mentality?
Do you all have only your friggin balance in mind when firing up sim? Really? 
I mean you cant completely forget about SL etc. since its part of the game, but to me it often feels like people treat this game like they'd treat a share portfolio or something.

Fly for the fun guys not SL, enjoy the planes you have, instead of always wanting the "next toy" (because you cant seem to realize that there will always be the "next toy").

There's a reason for that. The game's economy is it's primary driving force. You can fly what you want, but eventually, especially with EC's, you're going to reach a point that your losing so much SL that you cannot seriously justify keeping at it. 

  • Upvote 2
medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, FreePoland said:

Gaijin's fault for making research so slow and painful in AB/RB without premium

 

This is true. The grind towards Jets if you want to play them is an inhuman and very painful path...

  • Upvote 1
medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...