Leclerc S1 vs S2

[SturmWerwolf 788]

1 hour ago, Jackvony said:

I think there needs to be a recognition of the difference between classified and controlled. For example, I have access to US Army doctrine. Most of it is "approved for public release, distribution is unlimited." However some stuff (like the technical manual for the SEPv3) is not classified but its distribution is limited to DOD and Contractors only. So posting that on the forums would not be treason, just breaking the distribution code.

Yes, US Army Doctrine is release unlimited.

 

However, the technical manual for the SEPv3. Absolutely not. No way.

 

DISTRIBUTION STATEMENT C. Distribution authorized to U.S. Government agencies and their contractors (reason) (date of determination).
Other requests for this document shall be referred to (controlling DoD office). 

DISTRIBUTION STATEMENT D. Distribution authorized to Department of Defense and U.S. DoD contractors only (reason) (date of
determination). Other requests for this document shall be referred to (controlling DoD office). 

 

You mean those two. You need permission and the DoD will not give it to you. Especially with Foreigners having access.

 

@Conraire Can confirm that.

 

I have no idea about French Military regulations. Although, I assume they don't want the Driving  / Gunners manuals for their MBT posted online.

 

@Stona @Smin1080p You guys may wanna clarify what the French Government and / or whatever their DoD equivalent is allows in regards to this. I'm pretty certain those manuals are off limits.

Edited October 5, 2021 by SturmWerwolf

[Jackvony 597]

1 hour ago, SturmWerwolf said:

However, the technical manual for the SEPv3. Absolutely not. No way.

 

I literally said that. 

 

But there is a difference between breaking a distribution code and treason. I'm not saying the Leclerc manual was approved for public release.

 

I'm critiquing the reaction. Statements such as "lives of many on stake" and "real blood is spilled" are not helpful and simply inflammatory. The Challenger 2 incident should have been a lesson to us about fanning the flames on the fire and panicking. The forum reaction and then the spread to the internet made it way worse then it should have been when mods started talking about prison sentences and such. 

 

Irregardless I'm dragging us off topic, I've said my piece. 

Edited October 5, 2021 by Jackvony

[SturmWerwolf 788]

1 hour ago, Jackvony said:

 

I literally said that. 

 

But there is a difference between breaking a distribution code and treason. I'm not saying the Leclerc manual was approved for public release.

 

I'm critiquing the reaction. Statements such as "lives of many on stake" and "real blood is spilled" are not helpful and simply inflammatory. The Challenger 2 incident should have been a lesson to us about fanning the flames on the fire and panicking. The forum reaction and then the spread to the internet made it way worse then it should have been when mods started talking about prison sentences and such. 

 

Irregardless I'm dragging us off topic, I've said my piece. 

I think the statement of real casualties @JagdEnte said isn't meant to be inflammatory. I responded to him reiterating that reality, the world is full of hostile actors. Long, bloody wars in Iraq and Afghanistan with thousands of US Soldiers and Marines, killed, maimed and wounded. Being on the side of caution when dealing with these types of things is crucial. I can only speak for the US (SEP v3). I can't speak directly for how the British or French Governments operate, hence why I put out a ping for clarification.

 

Hopefully you understand that angle. I'm not directing anything at you or anyone else personally. These are just general statements about not being naive. We're all just playing games (entertainment) and people can easily forget outside that you have real world threats and strife.

[DieJagdente 1,384]

42 minutes ago, SturmWerwolf said:

I think the statement of real casualties @JagdEnte said isn't meant to be inflammatory. I responded to him reiterating that reality, the world is full of hostile actors. Long, bloody wars in Iraq and Afghanistan with thousands of US Soldiers and Marines, killed, maimed and wounded. Being on the side of caution when dealing with these types of things is crucial. I can only speak for the US (SEP v3). I can't speak directly for how the British or French Governments operate, hence why I put out a ping for clarification.

 

Hopefully you understand that angle. I'm not directing anything at you or anyone else personally. These are just general statements about not being naive. We're all just playing games (entertainment) and people can easily forget outside that you have real world threats and strife.

Thats my point the slight leak can cause people to try to exploit something, a Manuall can tell for example what the crew cannot do. But thats offtopic now

[Smin1080p 59,135]

3 hours ago, SturmWerwolf said:

 

@Stona @Smin1080p You guys may wanna clarify what the French Government and / or whatever their DoD equivalent is allows in regards to this. I'm pretty certain those manuals are off limits.

 

Its not for us to clarify what each government / authority allow. Put simply, we will not handle, pass, or allow any form of classified documentation / source and we will follow any legal procedure that follows said documentation. Unless clear authorative approval is posted that the source is not classified, we will treat it like it is and act on it as such with the necessary process as per any legal perimeters or requirements. 

 

Quote

WARNING: Please note! Any information or sources deemed restricted (not cleared for public release) by their respective ownership will not be accepted and will be dealt with according to any legal requirements,

 

 

[Haman_bighand 5]

On 04/10/2021 at 13:27, JagdEnte said:

Guys its not funnny to leak classified Documents of modern equipment you put the lives of many on stake who work daily with the Vehicles! Keep in Mind that those documents will be deleted immediately alongside sanctions. Thanks for reading!

 RESPECT

[Panther2995 809]

As far as i know Leclerc turret traverse rate and gun elevation speed bug was already reported with unclassified documents and that report approved by mods.

 

So im just wondering when will you guys fix these issues about Leclerc (turret traverse speed,hull armor ect.) since people are getting quite upset and even leaking classified documents because of slow implementation.  @Smin1080p

Edited October 5, 2021 by Panther2995

[Smin1080p 59,135]

14 minutes ago, Panther2995 said:

As far as i know Leclerc turret traverse rate and gun elevation speed bug was already reported with unclassified documents and that report approved by mods.

 

So im just wondering when will you guys fix these issues about Leclerc (turret traverse speed,hull armor ect.) since people are getting quite upset and even leaking classified documents because of slow implementation.  @Smin1080p

 

Historical issues (in fact all issues) can take time to validate, check source material and implement if they indeed are found to be incorrect. We have over 2000+ vehicles in game now and its no small task. 

 

The time it takes to review and process reports however is no reasoning, justification or any grounds to break legally defined permeameters in any way. We will always entirely reject any such documentation and resolve the matter with any legal requirements.  

[Panther2995 809]

Just now, Smin1080p said:

 

Historical issues (in fact all issues) can take time to validate, check source material and implement if they indeed are found to be incorrect. We have over 2000+ vehicles in game now and its no small task. 

 

The time it takes to review and process reports however is no reasoning, justification or any grounds to break legally defined permeameters in any way. We will always entirely reject any such documentation and resolve the matter with any legal requirements.  

İ understand the issue about classified documents and i agree with that.

 

What i dont understand is Leclerc is one of the most famous 3rd Gen tank you can find both ig and irl and ignoring those issues after months and months is not nice especially when they are the only valuable top tier vehicles for French tech tree.

 

İ know you said this game contains more then 2000 vehicle but we both know if you're guys want to fix or add something you can actually do it very quickly,especially if  its a small fix rather then adding completely new vehicle or new system into this game.

 

 

[totolescargo 568]

36 minutes ago, Panther2995 said:

As far as i know Leclerc turret traverse rate and gun elevation speed bug was already reported with unclassified documents and that report approved by mods.

Yes, right here.

 

36 minutes ago, Panther2995 said:

So im just wondering when will you guys fix these issues about Leclerc (turret traverse speed,hull armor ect.) since people are getting quite upset and even leaking classified documents because of slow implementation.  @Smin1080p

I myself made 3 bug reports about the Leclerc in the last 2 weeks.

2 historical bug reports and 1 regular bug report : 2 (1 of each category) are still pending for approval because only one was (rightfully) deemed important, being about a pressing issue.

The Leclerc MBTs are sadly crippled with historical inaccuracies in War Thunder.

 

Some are more negligible (orientation of the exhaust, turret rotation rate) than others (UFP, reload rate).

Individually, these issues aren't as bad as some make them out to be.

 

However, what actually hurts the Leclerc MBTs is the accumulation of all these issues.

If only 2 or 3 of the most important ones could be fixed, France would be a lot more comfortable to play at top tier.

 

 

Probably just a shot in the dark but ...

I'm aware that bug report are more important than historical bug reports in the Devs' eyes.
I'm also aware it may take time to look into them and that they will eventually come to fix them anyway.

But it's important to remind that the Leclerc MBTs are the most played vehicles out of the entirety of France's tech tree and that they're basically the only 2 vehicles France gets from 9.7 to 11.0.

So @Smin1080p, would it be possible for the Devs to give some kind of priority to the most important issues, or at least the UFP issue, before implementing the Leclerc S.XXI (whenever that would be) ?

 

It would be sad to see a new Leclerc variant being added only for it to suffer from the same old issues as it's predecessors.
France's community is especially worried about the UFP issue, since the Leclerc S.XXI's main upgrade was it's improved armor.

Adding the Leclerc S.XXI without the UFP fix would be a shame.

Edited October 5, 2021 by totolescargo

[[email protected] 1,484]

This has got to be the weirdest thread on this forum. It's simultaneously hilarious and horrifying. A person thought that leaking classified documents for a VIDEO GAME is a normal thing to do, and this person could quite literally be responsible for the death of many crewmen. 

[IWSM_soundmod 353]

1 hour ago, [email protected] said:

This has got to be the weirdest thread on this forum. It's simultaneously hilarious and horrifying. A person thought that leaking classified documents for a VIDEO GAME is a normal thing to do, and this person could quite literally be responsible for the death of many crewmen. 

whatever, what you say doesn't make sense.  This is not a top secret classified document so stop saying nonsense about it.  I feel like it's more of a disturbing thing so that I don't have to modify the Leclerc.

[[email protected] 1,484]

59 minutes ago, MBTAW_26 said:

whatever, what you say doesn't make sense.  This is not a top secret classified document so stop saying nonsense about it.  I feel like it's more of a disturbing thing so that I don't have to modify the Leclerc.

Do you want to be in news? The last guy who leaked the Chally's armour got in the news. Prepare for it.

[IWSM_soundmod 353]

2 hours ago, [email protected] said:

Do you want to be in news? The last guy who leaked the Chally's armour got in the news. Prepare for it.

Or not

[DieJagdente 1,384]

20 hours ago, MBTAW_26 said:

Or not

Lets not talk about that..

[MuricaxSuffers 1,806]

On 06/10/2021 at 19:22, [email protected] said:

Do you want to be in news? The last guy who leaked the Chally's armour got in the news. Prepare for it.

^you might have a link for that ?  

[Shahyn 34]

2 hours ago, MuricaxSuffers said:

^you might have a link for that ?  

https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/classified-tank-specs-leaked-on-war-thunder-game-forums-again/

There you go 

[IWSM_soundmod 353]

you love to speculate, on each article he only talks about (maybe), (apparently), (it is possible that).  in fact nothing concrete what concerning the classified character or not.  this is so absurd

[SpetsRaZor 6]

he thought not. but the military press is already talking about it and in belgium we have heard about it in the news

 

http://www.opex360.com/2021/10/07/des-donnees-confidentielles-sur-le-char-leclerc-auraient-fuite-sur-le-forum-dun-jeu-video/?fbclid=IwAR164fWRIIaGrtc0odWJvfELcQHx2IyxWhYup6gB2sxRUQhKvqQF1p3aT10
 

[IWSM_soundmod 353]

Whose fault, you answered a false rumor, now the idiots keep sharing.

[Laviduce 1,775]

Today I submitted additional information (a FEA study)  of potential special armor solutions for the Leclerc S1 (and S2) upper front hull and beak.  Using FEA i was able to come up with a special armor solution that was able to stop a KE projectile with a penetration performance well in excess of what is shown in the Leclerc model in War Thunder. Given this and the previous information I wonder what Gaijin will do with it all. I hope the front hull will get fixed.

[IWSM_soundmod 353]

On 30/10/2021 at 23:09, Laviduce said:

Today I submitted additional information (a FEA study)  of potential special armor solutions for the Leclerc S1 (and S2) upper front hull and beak.  Using FEA i was able to come up with a special armor solution that was able to stop a KE projectile with a penetration performance well in excess of what is shown in the Leclerc model in War Thunder. Given this and the previous information I wonder what Gaijin will do with it all. I hope the front hull will get fixed.

they will not do anything, the leclerc is underperforming in the game and this is wanted by the devs. Even with official documents, they find a trick not to use it. Don't waste your time

[[email protected] 51]

It's been like this for two years, it won't change overnight
gajin knows there have been many (very compelling) reports.
France is a minor country for them so it doesn't make enough money ....

gajin is on a slippery slope if they continue like this ....