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What makes this game so incredibly frustrating to play ?


Because of the grind, progression is so painfully slow in this game, a single death is just seen as another part of the delay, but the difference between a death in-game as opposed to rp costs, sl repair rates, having a stock vehicle and the like, the only part of the game that you can manipulate progression (gameplay) makes death worse and its your fault no matter how you try to look at it, when you know its going to take you over a month to unlock the next vehicle if you have flawless games, every single death has a toll on you because you know its going to take that much longer to reach the next vehicle/its going to cost you X amount of SL to repair, in addition to that its just frustrating when you have extensive knowledge and experience in the game and yet when you act optimally in a engagement somehow you still end up the one being dead And, if you play arcade while it does take the edge off a little in dying the rp gains are so abysmally low you'll never get anywhere in any decent time.

The crazy thing right, when Gaijin had that big event where everyone got to play top tier for all nations against each other, everyone I talked to and even myself said that was some of the most fun we ever had in this game, there was no stress in grinding the next vehicle there was no stock tank syndrome, we didn't have to worry about sl repair costs, we could just play with all these cool tanks and it was a good time, ever since then i've been trying to replicate that experience, haven't yet. My two cents.

Edited by _Pixy
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21 hours ago, Bugsquash said:

just gaijin - their answer to most problems seems to be to dump it on the players - I can't believe that gameplay was better 5 years ago than it is now

This.

100%.

Gameplay was indeed better years ago.

The more they "add" the less balanced it becomes.

And the simplest solutions are avoided for every more complex additions, not fixing the crumbling foundation.

It's like filling your home with pretty artwork while the basement is flooding and falling in.

 

Fix things like the spawn system. 

Bigger maps.

Better BR spread (which solves the bad BR problem in most cases. Some are just OBVIOUSLY overloaded tech trees like the THREE planes at the same BR that in real life replaced one another. F9F-2, F9F-5, and F9F-8. The replacement for the replacement shouldn't be at the same BR. That's just stupid.) 

 

Failure to fix the foundation means everything above that will fail as well.

 

 

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Like many others have said, its becuase they try to add to many things into the game. They've sidelined what was most fun about this game. I remember when ground battles was just tank on tank combat. No missle bs, no go karts zipping around the battlefield.

Another thing that has always bothered me is being bottom tier in a game, just knowing you're at a disadvantage from the start of the game is really off-putting to me.

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Game modes haven't changed (apart from Break being removed) since US tech tree implementation so gameplay became pretty linear. Newly added maps didn't elevate gameplay feeling either because those are mostly unnatural for tank combat to take place in. WT definately needs something new. Either in some new game mode or in overhauled Break mode or even in EC for ground forces.

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1 hour ago, KH_Alan said:

Game modes haven't changed (apart from Break being removed) since US tech tree implementation so gameplay became pretty linear. Newly added maps didn't elevate gameplay feeling either because those are mostly unnatural for tank combat to take place in. WT definately needs something new. Either in some new game mode or in overhauled Break mode or even in EC for ground forces.

 

And D point removal (I actually liked that random event, though was a very new player back then).

 

And SP change really altered the mode (and so in theory the general gameplay, for better and worse).

Edited by Deranger79
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Nothing really, but at the moment and hopefully this will change, the MM. It is totally out of control. First they stopped playing historical opponents, then they made Axis vs Allies and now it is every one against everyone. FANTASY MODE

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@Hartwiekruppstah the game is designed for newbies to give money, to achieve that, some vehicles that you MUST use to grind are badly nerfed against others, so you die from time to time, but actually so much more often than you get kills, this COULD cause frustation

 

but it could also be caused by other players, its so sad that many players in air rb crash to prevent you getting kill or continuous useless teams while enemy is cooperating as hell or.....

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What makes the game frustrating to me its been said a million times probably, its basically planes on ground forces. I dont mind being the lower br of the match since warthunder compared to other games its not that terrible to fight, you dont find yourself completely useless regardless the vehicle you use, even if you have a clear disadvantage.

But with the planes its another story, since i dont like how i kill a mildly incompetent tanker who basically spawns on the designated CAS, be this plane or helicopter, of his nation and just kills me, on a situation were i have no say on the subject, but it doesnt stops as he will go and kill 3 or more guys before it runs out of ammo.

Then you respawn on an anti-aircraft to try to stop the slaughter, but then if the player its a mildly competent pilot there is no way you even hit them, not even with radar, seemingly completely random patherns of flight combined with ingame mechanics that will allow them to not be affected by radar and very poorly developed mechanics such as proxy fuses which will detonate if rockets or atgms are launched towards you, not even stopping the said rocket/atgm that made it explode to begin with.

Jumping on an SPAA makes me think that i should have the same unfair advantage that planes have agains tanks, but you end just being softer targets that planes always aim to kill first, since most of this AA can be killed the easiest aswell, which is very frustrating. On this situation its easy that it ends in a 1 to 1, SPAA killed and plane killed, but now you dont have spaa and the enemy has planes, and that g91 /ka50/p47 that you didnt killed and wont be able to do so has killed 8 guys, making you feel punished for killing an enemy on the ground to begin with. 

The personal experience i have as it is now on AA its M163, WZ(chinese proxy fuse zsu-57-2), Otomatic and Roland, with their respective lower tiers, being otomatic the biggest disappointment, as it seems to be once again a better antitank than antiaircraft, where the helicopters/planes you kill are often just people that doesnt knows how to play them or are extremely reckless, even then i would even say that the SIDAM its a more reliable SPAA.

Russians stomping on ground rn on top tier its of little concern to me, not because i dont play, its just because today its the russians, months ago was the leopard2A5, year and something was the abrams that needed its own separated matchmaking because how broken it was, etc. Its been happening for a while anyway. Besides those are enemies that you can still fight with a decent enough gun.

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"What makes this game so incredibly frustrating to play?" you say?

 

Heres my list of fustrations with the game.

 

  • The blantant pay 2 win tactics with premium tanks, jets, and Helicopters
    • examples?
      • Ka-50 with its missile loadout
      • the KV1C on germany is wayyyyy op
      • G91 series especially (includes the R/4) with Nords at low BR is annoying.
      • there is more but the list would go on for quite a bit, its mostly loadouts that make air premium OP as it is, for ground its armor or ammo loadouts.
      • they say they wouldn't do a top tier premium, sorry but Ka-50 is top tier premium at 10.3, same for other 10.3 heli's
  • No real counter for ground vehicles too engage air targets, sure we get adats and what not, but early BR's the Bofors or other flak reliant guns do not perform as they should.
    • there are ways around this, guns that normally fire flak in rl settings should be able to equip basically proxy fused shells, but heavily reliant on crew skill, like ranging in a target. Sadly without the means of aim assist for AA in RB's, it makes it difficult to cover/protect ground targets from early jets or turbo prop planes. Especially in BR 6 - 7, in BR 8+ is when radar assisted weapons are implemented, however their uses are limited as again, proxy fused shells are not adjusted or implemented in the game, and should be automatic and more accurate for radar assisted guidance.
  • The Ka-50 with its current loadout.
    • right now this thing has no real counter for it other than jets, but even then that is threatened as it can track, lock, and fire upon jets, especially in the new update as it can fire a full salvo of its OP missiles, the same is going to happen with the ka-52, however it is at 10.7, but! having 10km missiles on a heli should be set to equal of those on other nations, the average being 5, it should also be 5km.
  • M1 Abrams series is way too soft for upper tier play, and only useful in long range defensive setting, and the armor model is way too outdated as having 'gaps' in the turret or hull when facing off with 10.7 USSR or Germany makes it nothing more than a target to shoot anywhere on.
    • with maps concentrating on offensive play, which favor mostly German and USSR tanks, the US is left in the dust along with other nations that do not have high BR tanks, ill also chime in on a map solution for this later as it is also another issue that I have.
    • Russia with Kontact 5 plating on the front can take several kinetic hits, make mistakes more often than their counterparts.
    • Germany has like the strongest turret, but that is to be expected.
    • Russia soon to be having 3 10.7, Germany with 3, and US only with 1 also spells bad news, as Russia and Germany are going to be spammed at upper BR
  • Unfair balance with upper BR tree, Every nation should have equal amounts of 10.7 tanks, US has 1, China has none, Japan has none, Germany has 1 currently... soon to be 2, and so on, you get the idea. Doing such loadouts allows the player to stay in the battle longer, with a more effective tank on the field. The US Cannot stay in the battle as long as the Russians and soon to be the same for Germany.
  • The Objectives on maps are offensive setting, there is like no defensive means, and when there is defensive points its in a spot where it is difficult to defend, or out of reach, so tanks built for a defensive stance has to over extend themselves, which is basically a death sentence.
  • Tracks absorbing a 600mm pen APFSDS round shouldn't be a thing, especially if it makes the track go red and not break.
  • Armor Models for most US tanks are inaccurate or stupid. Sure there is alot of confidential documents that you cannot obtain to learn about the Merkava 3D or the Abrams, but common sense should also be taken into consideration as having gaps in the armor, isn't exactly accurate to begin with.
  • The Abrams line is garbage right now, as rounds are just a hot knife though butter. A Russian 9.3 tank can frontally pen the Abrams, either the M1 or the IMP1.
  • maps where you can shoot into spawn, from spawn.
  • spawn camping (not spawn pushing, there is a difference).
  • BR compression, there needs to be more variants.
    • example: they could have done the SEP and TUSK variants of tanks on the US line, but chosen not too.
      • like the M3A3 Bradley had both Commander optics and a optional TUSK package. With TOW II, that can fire both tandem missiles with 900mm of pen in rl, or the top down TOW seen on the US Helicopters.
  • incorrect ammo loadouts for tanks.
    • example: the Bradley is using a Vietnam era TOW when it reality it used the ITOW. A difference of 200mm of pen.
  • Repair costs and when combined with BR changes needs to stop, You dont raise the cost of repair and raise it in BR like you did with the T32 series.

 

Mostly its just the blatant bogus that I've been seeing with the tech trees so far, and bogus balancing factors.

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Also there is the shifting meta.

Not the game evolving, everyone likes that. No, the way you can really enjoy a vehicle and along comes an upgrade that makes that vehicle useless. It's happened significantly twice in my narrow range of interests, the first with aircraft coming along and making open-tops pointless and the second with the Swedish reserve tanks being laser snipers. 
Both these have commercial arguments; War Thunder really is an aircraft game and giving flyers human ground targets was a brilliant business move and forcing people out of lower tiers makes them grind. It doesn't mean I have to like it though. However it does make me search around for other games.

I'm sure there's other examples that don't impact me so much.

Edited by DeadlyTreadly
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Never ending server issues.

I no longer care at all about the upcoming patch on any level... I'd just settle for having a technical update that would allow me to not be constantly sitting expecting something to fail at Gaijin's end.

Three games attempted tonight and every single one of them resulted in being frozen out and returned to the hangar... there wont be a fourth attempt.... 

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8 hours ago, Fa11enPhoenix said:

Never ending server issues.

I no longer care at all about the upcoming patch on any level... I'd just settle for having a technical update that would allow me to not be constantly sitting expecting something to fail at Gaijin's end.

Three games attempted tonight and every single one of them resulted in being frozen out and returned to the hangar... there wont be a fourth attempt.... 

 

Last time I had this problem, it was my RAM. Didn't think so first, but ran prime95 to make sure. Surprise.

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PLANE ON GROUND BATTLES!!!

FED UP OF THIS S....!

 

Especially since the on-board armament of planes is largely overestimated. it is laughable. we can really wonder what screwed up all the pilots who risked their lives during the second world war, it was simply enough to strafe the tanks with the machine gun or the 20mm cannon if we believe this game...  where is the historical respect? (besides all these armored as the R3 T20 FA HS, ASU 57 or 85 against armored WWII) Silly. now thanks to these ... if planes spawn at the start of the game we only serve as a target. we can't even hide in a wood because they can spot and find you there without any problem. Yeah, this is high level balancing

Edited by Arsenal53
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On 10/11/2020 at 06:15, Dodo_Dud said:

 

Last time I had this problem, it was my RAM. Didn't think so first, but ran prime95 to make sure. Surprise.

 

Worth a look but having done nothing it worked just fine the following night and again tonight.:dntknw:

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On 04/11/2020 at 22:24, GhostUnitVII said:

Heres my list of fustrations with the game.

I was pleased that MOST of your list is HIGH TIER only...which means i will have no issue for a long time... ;)

 

A few exceptions...

On 04/11/2020 at 22:24, GhostUnitVII said:

The Objectives on maps are offensive setting, there is like no defensive means

All battles are basically meeting engagements. You can go on defensive AFTER you take the objectives...BUT to be honest, almost all players will continue attacking. You can actually do well if you opt to defend on a good place from the probable counter-attack. Many times the team mates that rush past cap will die and the enemy will come back...

The only instance i recall of defensive playing from start was the "convoy" scenarios in Naval...but for some reason they were discontinued...

(I actually liked them a lot...the diference between the two roles was interesting)

 

I am assuming the main problem is BALANCE. In meeting engagements both teams can be "similar". On "Assaults" you need to have a 3:1 ratio or so BUT this depends on the specific terrain AND eventual fixed defenses (that do not exist). In the end i am guessing this was also what "doomed" the convoy scenarios. Players kept complaining ONE SIDE had the advantage...

 

On 04/11/2020 at 22:24, GhostUnitVII said:
  • spawn camping (not spawn pushing, there is a difference).
  • BR compression, there needs to be more variants.

These never bothered me much...up to BR6 in ground forces at least. They do happen, but not enough to be a big issue IMHO.

On 04/11/2020 at 22:24, GhostUnitVII said:

incorrect ammo loadouts for tanks.

This depends...i am not knowledgeable enough to spot the issues...but i do get what i read in forum. Some cases are annoying and could be fixed, but don't forget BRs would also change. Some tanks will become much weaker if they lose their best ammo...

 

On 04/11/2020 at 22:24, GhostUnitVII said:

Repair costs and when combined with BR changes needs to stop

Repair costs do raise a lot as you move up in BR...probably the thing that prevents many players from moving up and playing in high BRs...at least they cant play a lot...up to BR6 is manageable, but i am beginning to feel the problem...

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On 12/11/2020 at 08:47, [email protected] said:

I was pleased that MOST of your list is HIGH TIER only...which means i will have no issue for a long time...

Give it time :P

 

On 12/11/2020 at 08:47, [email protected] said:

All battles are basically meeting engagements. You can go on defensive AFTER you take the objectives...BUT to be honest, almost all players will continue attacking. You can actually do well if you opt to defend on a good place from the probable counter-attack. Many times the team mates that rush past cap will die and the enemy will come back...

The only instance i recall of defensive playing from start was the "convoy" scenarios in Naval...but for some reason they were discontinued...

(I actually liked them a lot...the diference between the two roles was interesting)

 

I am assuming the main problem is BALANCE. In meeting engagements both teams can be "similar". On "Assaults" you need to have a 3:1 ratio or so BUT this depends on the specific terrain AND eventual fixed defenses (that do not exist). In the end i am guessing this was also what "doomed" the convoy scenarios. Players kept complaining ONE SIDE had the advantage...

Not... what I really meant by that, nor convoy scenarios. Ya see, US tanks currently are not designed for offensive play, well not in the game atleast, just too much exposure at high tier when you are in a Abrams, the UFP of the M1 series is much too soft, because they were nerfed awhile back and it was never removed. So now the most reliable thing with the US is hulldown tactics, problem is the objectives are in spots where there isn't much in defensive cover, or are in the open which would work for a offensive tank... like the T-72B3 with its Kontact 5 armor, or the T-80U. There isn't any equal ground, because that is how the tanks are configured and how the map progression is designed.

 

What I mean by objective based game play is where you cannot attack the spawn or go wide around the map to hit the rear flank, sure it is a tactic but it doesn't benefit the game play as objectives are key elements in winning the game. People just do wide flanks to either just get kills or be blatantly annoying without contributing to their team. Nothing good comes from spawn camping, but when you 'spawn pushing' as they call it, would just mean that the enemy has lost as they had lost control of the map.

 

On 12/11/2020 at 08:47, [email protected] said:

These never bothered me much...up to BR6 in ground forces at least. They do happen, but not enough to be a big issue IMHO.

Spawn camping is more suited to what I said above, but it still stands. Once you start entering matches with fast tanks, you will see how annoying it can get when you have a Rad 90 shooting into the spawn in a spot where it isn't suppose to reach.

 

BR compression is mostly in the 6.7 and up, especially around 8.0, because you will run into tanks at 9.0 which have thermals, again compression is bad, there isn't anything that a 8.0 non thermal tank can do against a L/44 or a C2A1, this is also why the T-55AM-1 was reduced in BR, because it lacked thermals, and was sitting at 8.7, problem is with it sitting at 8.3 is the fact that it runs into early cold war era tanks, or late world war II tanks. a M26E1 should not run into a T-55AM-1. Either fix BR compression or remove 1 up and down BR match making.

 

On 12/11/2020 at 08:47, [email protected] said:

This depends...i am not knowledgeable enough to spot the issues...but i do get what i read in forum. Some cases are annoying and could be fixed, but don't forget BRs would also change. Some tanks will become much weaker if they lose their best ammo...

Not alot of people are knowledgeable in this area, but it still bothers me that a 9.7 (the T-72B) using the 3BM42 which gets 479mm pen at 0, and 246mm pen at 60. Now for 'balance' sake and as you would put "Some tanks will become much weaker if they lose their best ammo...", Lets bring up that M1 Abrams at 10.0? M774 shot gets 357mm at 0, and 206mm at 60... and that 3BM42 round, would go though, every time at 500m, or a 1000m, it doesn't matter where it will aim it will just go though, yet for some magical reason the M1 Abrams cannot touch a T-72B at that range. That's what really bothers me, the balancing factors in this game are blatantly one sided, and yet people are so much denial about it.

 

Just give it time m8, this game would just be another 'Heroes and Generals' flop when people get annoyed enough and just leave. Especially once the 'new power' update comes out cuz having nations with 2+ 10.7's just sounds nasty, where they can stay in the match longer, with more effective tanks in their lineup.

Edited by GhostUnitVII
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Extremely bad teams/players.  That is all.

Why do players INTENTIONALLY throw away a clear win, just to get 10 more SL in a cap and lose 1000s of SL/RP instead?  The mind boggles.

Edited by Deranger79
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