Synthjaeger

Pvstrv AMX - The Swedish AMX-13

AMX-13 (early) as a Swedish premium tank  

97 members have voted

  1. 1. AMX-13 (early) for the Swedes?

    • Yes.
    • I respectfully disagree with this suggestion.
  2. 2. If yes, how?

    • In a pack.
    • Buyable with GEs.
    • Unlockable (Swedish event, special event..).
    • I said no.
  3. 3. Give it a skin with the Swedish markings, and make them persistent (as for the Italian Sherman tanks)?

    • Sure, let's make the skins more fancies!
    • I don't care.
    • No.
    • I said no.


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Pvstrv AMX - The Swedish AMX-13

 

 

 

Hi tankists of War Thunder, today I bring you the Swedish modified AMX-13.  Thanks for reading, don't forget to vote!

 

History:

After World War 2, Sweden understood the need for a modern tank in order to protect their country from invasions, especially because of their proximity with USSR. As their m/42 were going old, it has been decided to begin studies for a new whole indigenous design (S-tank project), aside upgrading their m/42s. France was very famous at the beginning of the Cold War, as our military industry was completely rebooted and boosted with some innovative equipments and concepts. Aside French planes and SS.11 missiles, one is also very famous: I'm talking about oscillating turrets.

 

Spoiler

amx13%2075%202a%2006%20suez%201956%20pho

A French oscillating turret.

4.jpg

Oscillating turret on an Panhard EBR (soon in game I hope :p:).

 

Sweden was very open to last military concepts in order to build the best modern tank as possible, and they've ordered an early AMX-13 (French serial 608 0450) in order to test it. The tank wasn't keep, as the Centurion tanks (Strv 81, 101, 102, 103, 104) offered longer ranged gun and better protection for their crew. But, even if the AMX-13 wasn't keep, it influenced a lot the Swedish studies, first for the Kranvagn and then for the S-tank concept. The AMX-13 and the oscillating turret have influenced a lot the very long development that has lead to the Strv 103.

 

Fun fact:

During the development of the Strv 74, there was a suggestion made in order to combine the FL-10 turret with the Kan Strv 74 7.5 cm canon. Sadly, the machine was never built.

 

Some pictures in Swedish service (swedish s/n 80 308):

Spoiler

amx13-5.jpg

 

amx13-4.jpg

 

amx13-2.jpg

 

Characteristics:

Spoiler

Overall:

Well, this will be a bit hard. To begin, as we can see that this AMX-13 isn't equipped with an FL-10 turret. As shown here, there are two antennas (then radio, so would it could have the artillery call and spotter features enabled ingame), no smoke grenades

 

Which AMX-13 variant is this Swedish AMX-13?

Well, it's kinda hard to determine which correct variant  is it. As there isn't the FL10 turret, and how are done the wheels, it should be the AMX-13(2A) variant. I'll need some help to identify it correctly, and to find the early turret characteristics.

 

This part will be updated as soon as possible.

 

Weaponry

Canon: heavily modified SA50 gun with original breach and hold, but with special barrel, autoloader and muzzle brake for the Swedish APDS ammunitions (same as the one for Strv 74) ;

Machineguns: 8mm Ksp m/36 or m/39 coaxial and roof machineguns ;

 

Thanks to @blockhaj for additionnal data and explanations.

 

Swedish report of AMX-13 trials:

Thanks to @nxdefiant001, the complete trials report is available here in French:

https://tanks.mod16.org/2014/09/25/reports-in-french-on-the-swedish-trials-of-the-amx-13/

 

Why I'm proposing the AMX-13 (early) for Sweden:

  • The AMX-13 has heavily influenced the Swedish tanks studies, for the Strv 74, Kranvagn, Emil, Emil II and S-tanks concepts (which will finally lead up later to the Strv 103) ;
  • Originally bought and heavily modified by Sweden during military exercise in order to test it, it's not a captured vehicle ;
  • A premium vehicle that could help to grind the tree ;
  • Another French touch to the Swedish tree (:DD).

 

Sources:

https://www.ointres.se/amx-13.htm (the whole story in Swedish)

Images of War - The AMX 13 Light Tank: A Complete History, Peter Lau, 2017

Tanks encyclopedia

Wikipedia

http://www.chars-francais.net

War Thunder wiki

World of Tanks wiki (yes, sorry)

Edited by Sternjager
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Open for discussion. :salute:

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2 minutes ago, nxdefiant001 said:

Amazing, thank you!

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Awh! I was going to write a thread about this too, but you beat me to it!

 

Just a sidenote, the tanks.mod16.org post on the reports about the AMX-13 trails are in French. But the blog post itself states that those are French translations of Swedish reports and feedback on the tank. So you have got confirmation on two possible primary sources for this.

 

Now, onto a personal note. I would prefer this as a regular unlockable. But that's just me. I support this suggestion.

Edited by Arne7
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9 minutes ago, Arne7 said:

Awh! I was going to write a thread about this too, but you beat me to it!

 

Just a sidenote, the tanks.mod16.org post on the reports about the AMX-13 trails are in French. But the blog post itself states that those are French translations of Swedish reports and feedback on the tank. So you have got confirmation on that two possible primary sources for this.

 

Now, onto a personal note. I would prefer this as a regular unlockable. But that's just me. I support this suggestion.

Roger that, thank you!

 

And as the vehicle is unique with a trial livery.. that's why I propose it as a premium.

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@Sternjager il y a un pb avec ton scrutin, si on vote non, on n'est pas sensé répondre aux questions du dessous, sauf qu'il faut répondre aux questions du dessous pour que le vote soit pris en compte.

Edited by Otto4980
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14 minutes ago, Otto4980 said:

@Sternjager il y a un pb avec ton scrutin, si on vote non, on n'est pas sensé répondre aux questions du dessous, sauf qu'il faut répondre aux questions du dessous pour que le vote soit pris en compte.

@Otto4980 the last answer of each question is here for this:

image.thumb.png.eb982f184df4ab52a4a7e434

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1 hour ago, Milocat said:

+1, Sweden could use some more tanks and this is a fitting addition.  

Thank you! But sadly some peoples don't agree.

Edited by Sternjager
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I mean, the other option is to suggest adding the four different British tanks which also were on trails and evaluations on Swedish terrain. Right now, there are not so much that the Swedish ground forces tree can offer for both Rank 2 and 3, or at least the equivalent BRs of those. The other vehicles befitting those ratings are already in the suggestions but not being considered yet, and most of them are just variants of the already existing Rank 1 and 2 vehicles. And their upgrades aren't much enough to compensate for the raised BR-ratings, in my opinion.

 

Overall, the French would get the chance to see a familiar face in an other tree, and the Swedish get another Rank 4(-equivalent) in their collection; premium or not.

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7 minutes ago, Arne7 said:

the other option is to suggest adding the four different British tanks

I've sent four more suggestions (including two Swedish centurions), just wait for their approval.. :p:

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While I'm not very much in favor of purely export test vehicles to be used in game, I could see it as an event vehicle.

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9 hours ago, Sternjager said:

Thank you! But sadly some peoples don't agree.

Just because a Test drived Vehicule isn't a National Active Service one.

The difference is that the Tested one never got bought by the nation you proposed it for, then never used it for Active Service/Combat.

Edited by Cpt_Bel_V
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2 hours ago, Cpt_Bel_V said:

Just because a Test drived Vehicule isn't a National Active Service one.

The difference is that the Tested one never got bought by the nation you proposed it for, then never used it for Active Service/Combat.

For you no, for me and some peoples it's okay. That's why there's a voting system.

 

Every suggestion has to be studied. That's all.

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I don't understand why so many people are against this suggestion. The Swedish tested the AMX-13 with its own registration and unique Swedish camo, what's there not to like. Some of you are too strict about this. If I wanted to be picky I could talk about the one Jumbo the French ever used that somehow ended up in the regular tree yet I don't complain.

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Ordinarily I'd be against this, since it was only trialled and not used, but Sweden is a special case. Even if one of the only other turreted Tier III candidates was added, like Pvkv IV Varjan, none of them look like they'd fit at a BR similar to Strv 74 and would therefore be of more limited use in a lineup with it. There simply isn't another tank likely to fit at this BR, let alone one of this specific type (Sweden does not have many light tanks) and its influence on their other designs is undeniable. The deciding factor for me is that there isn't another option, which is why I (begrudgingly) support this but don't support the "Swedish" Tiger II (P) that just got passed to development. The KT would be a 6.3 premium and there are other options around that BR, like the ~6.7 BR Strv 81 Batch II, which is a Centurion Mk.5 and differs from the tree example (a Mk.3) mainly by having an AA MG and some other minor differences. This AMX-13 does not have such a replacement, and is therefore the best option. Better to add it as a premium so the people who want it can have it than to have nothing filling the gap. Personally, I'm not too invested in it, but if it came I might be tempted to get it, if only because it's a bit different from the French one and I love the Strv 74. Good suggestion, and you have my support.

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We trialed it with APDS, the same as on the Strv 74 etc but loaded into the french casings which means higher muzzle velocity and there were serious plans to add a Swedish MG to the turret but i am unsure if that was ever done (il look up the docs later). What was trialed though were several types of ice removers for the wheels.

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57 minutes ago, blockhaj said:

We trialed it with APDS, the same as on the Strv 74 etc but loaded into the french casings which means higher muzzle velocity and there were serious plans to add a Swedish MG to the turret but i am unsure if that was ever done (il look up the docs later). What was trialed though were several types of ice removers for the wheels.

France has an APDS for the AMX-13. It was to give it more firepower.  Why would Sweden gets APDS and not the French ?  (there's a similar problem at 1.0 with the missing SA38 apds (from 1939) while swedes gets theirs)

Capture d’écran 2020-03-22 à 03.37.02.png

Edited by nxdefiant001

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3 minutes ago, nxdefiant001 said:

France has an APDS for the AMX-13. It was to give it more firepower.  Why would Sweden gets APDS and not the French ?  (there's a similar problem at 1.0 with the missing SA38 apds (from 1939) while swedes gets theirs)

 

 

No one's saying France shouldn't get their APDS, just that Sweden also used APDS.

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12 minutes ago, nxdefiant001 said:

France has an APDS for the AMX-13. It was to give it more firepower.  Why would Sweden gets APDS and not the French ?  (there's a similar problem at 1.0 with the missing SA38 apds (from 1939) while swedes gets theirs)

Capture d’écran 2020-03-22 à 03.37.02.png

Well if it is missing then bug report it with all the necessary data. The idea of giving the Swedish AMX-13 APDS is to make it different from the French one. Even if both get APDS in the end they would have 2 totally different APDS shells.

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Just now, Tasty95215 said:

 

No one's saying France shouldn't get their APDS, just that Sweden also used APDS.

And they have it on their Strv 74. While France don't have it.

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