Nicholas_Concu

Italian M8 Greyhound

M8 Greyhound for Italy  

76 members have voted

  1. 1. Add M8 Greyhound to Italy?

    • Yeah! +1
      39
    • No -1
      37
  2. 2. Tech tree,premium or event?

    • Tech tree
      27
    • Premium
      8
    • Event
      5
    • I said '' no ''
      36


The Italian M8 Greyhound.

General info

During the final stages of the second world war, Royalist Italy who still supported the king, opposed to mussolini would see themselves join the war effort on the allies side, at this moment of time the Co-Beligerent Armed forces would be made, which would be supported by the allies in fighting back Nazi Germany and the Facist state known as the RSI. The Co-Beligerent Armed forces would be equipped and supplied with standard issue allied equipment, this included vehicles such as the Greyhounds. After the war was over America had a surplus of these M8 Greyhounds, so what better way to give them a use than to donate them to one of their allies that needed it the most. Italy put the M8 Greyhound in offical service from the 1950s-1960s, in which then got withdrawn out of service without replacement. In Italian service, most of the greyhounds were used inside of postwar Italian armoured divisons and by 'reparti esploranti'.This helped Italy re-arm itself and still be a somwhat useful ally if the soviet union ever decided to invade the rest of the west, which at the time was a very major concern. Most M8 Greyhounds in Italy have now become static displays inside of muesems and around city's, however some still survive in working order by either priviate collectors or special organisations.

Armament+Equipment
37/54 cannon
2 browning machine guns (12.7mm)
Specifications

38ab128ba072afa871eefadcd4f95174.png.076
Why it should be added
This could be a very nice premium or low tier vehicle added to Italy, its not too hard to implement and although i can see why people won't like copy pasted vehicles inside of trees, Italy, especially at lower tier is a pain to grind through, so maybe adding something like the M8 greyhound that many players are already familiar with in terms of playstyle could become benefical in the long run. Although i myself don't agree with the American greyhound being a premium/event vehicle (should be in the tech tree) i wouldn't be suprised if this becomes an event vehicle in the future. The vehicle itself in my opinion would be a great addition inside of the italian tech tree.
Sources
http://www.esercito.difesa.it/en/history/pagine/m8-light-armored-vehicle-greyhound.aspx
http://www.ferreamole.it/contributi/vignocchi/vignocchi_01.htm
https://targheitaliane.it/monografie/esercito_blindati_corazzati.pdf
https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/M8_Greyhound
https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/M8_Greyhound

https://www.dday-overlord.com/en/material/vehicles/m8-greyhound
https://tanks-encyclopedia.com/ww2/US/M8_Greyhound.php
Pictures
Immagine correlata1580080679_M8Greyhound.jpg.dc8ea3b3f24bd
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E7645CA1-3AEC-4256-8B29-0C358D293506.thuimage1.jpg?width=633&height=475
E6030ABE-9CCD-43DF-BAC6-912B1F7687BE.thu1409509641_M8GREYHOUND3.thumb.jpg.c320b2378410497_M8GREYHOUND4.thumb.jpg.14652af
image2.jpg?width=633&height=475image0.jpg

M8 GREYHOUND 5.jpg

Edited by Nicholas_Concu
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No. 

First of all, because this is an Allied (American) vehicle, which is bound to cause even more confusion and TK in Simulator Battles.

Second, because it actually isn't needed at all, since the Autoblinda 41/43 are already present, filling the same role and with very similar performance. 

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19 minutes ago, FouManchou said:

No. 

First of all, because this is an Allied (American) vehicle, which is bound to cause even more confusion and TK in Simulator Battles.

Second, because it actually isn't needed at all, since the Autoblinda 41/43 are already present, filling the same role and with very similar performance. 


At this point it doesn't matter, China already has one in their tech tree, and if people can't tell the difference between which vehicle is from which nation thats their problem at the end of the day, its not like the vehicle will look exactly the same as the ones already inside the American and Chinese tech trees, it'll most likley have a different camo which will be able to make it distinguishable in the battlefield.
Next the whole point of not 'needing' it doesn't apply, i have explained that this vehicle (if added) will most likley become a preimum, if it does it'll have the use of being able to grind the Italian tech tree easier at lower tiers, which will help a lot in the long run. If it doesn't become a premium it will still have a use, mainly to help people who've got experience playing the vehicle on another nation. 

Edited by Nicholas_Concu
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17 minutes ago, FouManchou said:

No. 

First of all, because this is an Allied (American) vehicle, which is bound to cause even more confusion and TK in Simulator Battles.

Second, because it actually isn't needed at all, since the Autoblinda 41/43 are already present, filling the same role and with very similar performance. 

You mean like the French Jumbo being paired with the Germans and fighting against other American Jumbos. If we criticize everyone else for their copy/paste material the rest will just come back to haunt the French and we can't afford anymore setbacks than we already have. Give the Italians their Greyhound and be done with it. 

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35 minutes ago, Private_Wolk said:

You mean like the French Jumbo being paired with the Germans and fighting against other American Jumbos. If we criticize everyone else for their copy/paste material the rest will just come back to haunt the French and we can't afford anymore setbacks than we already have. Give the Italians their Greyhound and be done with it. 

Exactly!
 

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+1, it was used and I do love the Greyhound.  I'm also a big fan of tier 1 ground vehicles in general.  And finally, Italy could use something fast at tier 1 with a heavier gun than a 20mm.

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Yes, but only as a premium, or event vehicle. Also I want the dog on the tank. Also pls move the M8 to the tree, and replace it with another M8 Modification :(

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As I said before, I don't want to see this as a tree vehicle for Italy, and only with the dog, I don't think the current lend-lease equipment should stay either, but that's an entirely different topic.

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On 07/05/2020 at 01:54, Conte_Baracca said:

ALL YOUR ARMORED CAR ARE BELONG TO ITALY

IF it exeeds 70 km/h on road and has 4 wheels it is a italian vehicle by definition, so yeah +1

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1. How about no? Not unless gaijin will fix that ret**ded way of dealing with their own decisions which summarizes itself in "whatever" - that's how i see it after having more and more new vehicles being added to sim lineups only because they are new, no matter what are these vehicles, while removing old ones, like french H-34, AH-1F or -lately- Mi-24V (yes, that one dissapeared too).

Gaijin states that they will not remove captured/borrowed/lent vehicles from SIM (not just from game, but from sim as well!), because -as they stated- players would LOSE THE CHANCE TO PLAY THAT NATION. Where? Not just on AB, not just on RB, but on sim TOO*

So, if gaijin don't want players to be unable to play EVERY vehicle EVERYWHERE, INCLUDING SIM, why they are removing those helis i mentioned? American H-34 is doing fine, hanging on list, while french one was missing since may of 2020 or 2019 (!) - i don't even remember for how long it's gone, as it was definitely for TOO LONG.

Unless they can add italy to BOTH trees and divide this nation by selectively picking up vehicles to fight on proper side (allied vehicles on Allies side, italian vehicles on Axis side), all allied italians should be removed without adding new ones to the sim.

If you want italian Greyhound, Sherman, Hellcat, Chaffee, etc. play with them on AB or RB. Only these two. But leave sim alone.

Not when US ground flag is still available and unlockable for EVERYONE. This flag (that is unlockable with kills), along with other flags (from flags section, to buy for gold) of in-game present nations should be restricted to proper nations - just like national roundels, which CAN'T be painted on wrong nation's machine. Like RAF roundel, silver star, etc.

These ones:

Gaijin shouldn't cover themselves with such idiotic argument like "we don’t plan to remove similar vehicles from the setups because players who are researching specific game nation trees will simply lose the opportunity to play in SB mode", especially if "technically it is impossible to make the ground vehicles of one nation fighting on two teams at once", because being forced to play against italian/japanese shermans/m18 which are overbushed/overpainted with mentioned US flag or other allied markings/decals, ruins the sim mode; identification mechanic works too slow, not to mention that target is often covered/moving between obstacles and breaking line-of-sight.

Nothing is more frustrating than being killed by enemy that you could kill easily fist, but you spared him because he looked like an ally. Or killing an ally, because he had enemy's markings.

Let it be on AB, on RB but not on SIM. Or make allies flags (including gold ones)/roundels blocked for axis vehicles.Or split axis nations for SB, so italian/japanese shermans/hellcats/chaffees will fight alongside of allies against italians/japanese in italian/japanese tanks.

 

2.

On 01/01/2020 at 00:49, WayOfTheWolk said:

You mean like the French Jumbo being paired with the Germans and fighting against other American Jumbos. If we criticize everyone else for their copy/paste material the rest will just come back to haunt the French and we can't afford anymore setbacks than we already have. Give the Italians their Greyhound and be done with it. 

 

On 01/01/2020 at 01:25, Nicholas_Concu said:

Exactly!
 

Tell me where french jumbo fights alongside germans against american jumbos.

I'll tell you - it's AB or RB. But not SB.

On 01/01/2020 at 00:24, FouManchou said:

No. 

First of all, because this is an Allied (American) vehicle, which is bound to cause even more confusion and TK in Simulator Battles.

Second, because it actually isn't needed at all, since the Autoblinda 41/43 are already present, filling the same role and with very similar performance. 

Gaijin blindly adds news vehicles into sim, whatever these vehicles are. While old ones are mysteriously dissapearing from SB lists.

If you want acceptance/tolerance (true tolerance, not that modern corrupted "definition") of your idea by sim part of WT community about this vehicle, "propose" (beg, force, threaten, spam, whatever) to gaijin to add italian Greyhound into game, but, in the name of everything, DO NOT ADD ITALIAN GREYHOUND TO SBGF LINEUPS. ANY OF THEM. NOT WHEN THEY WILL PLAY AGAINST ALLIES INSTEAD OF ALONG THEM.

 

I don't care much if it will be in game, i don't even care if it will be in sim mode. Moreover, it would be nice to have something more mobile and with greater firepower than italian reserves, as i've been playing them and i find them the worst tanks in the game - worst even than french or japanese tanks.

But what i care is on which side these vehicles will be playing on.

As for me, as i stated in multipe times in just this one post alone and even more multiple times in other posts -to make it really, REEEAAAAAAALLY clear- italian borrowed/lend lease vehicles are acceptable ONLY if they are fighting ALONG Allies, against Axis. Not otherwise, like now it is.

Greyhound is too small, fragile and practically useless to fight in postwar lineups against T-55, etc. (as Italians fights there along NATO side, plus Italy got allied vehicles just at the end/after ww2). It can be on proper, balanced tier/BR/early lineup, but only when they will fight ALONG other Greyhounds, Crusaders, Stuarts, Valentines, BT-5, etc., AGAINST Panzers, Pumas, Autoblindas, Fiats, etc.

 

China is damn tricky, and i admit that i've been playing capt on Sim (only Chi-Ha and Chi-Ha Kai yet). But, in case you didn't guessed it yet, i'm always revealing that on spawn, i'm always telling which markings i have on me, and i'm always using proper decals instead of playing ninja (i'm never playing as stupid ninja). Because Republic of China roundel is blocked until 34 battles were WON (not just played, but won), i've been using Commie China roundel on Chinese-captured-Japanese tank (once i unlock ROC roundel, i'm replacing PRoC one).

So Allies will see that i'm with them; so they will not need to get angry as they will lose silver in case of teamkill.

And it partially worked. Just partially, because low tiers are always cancerogenic, especially at earlier hours than "mid"/late afternoon. Today i've been teamkilled purposefully. In swedish tank, so there couldn't be mistake. Especially that, when i asked "why", he just responded "why not?" and kept teamkilling other players.

 

 

 

* "Q. Can you tell us if you plan to improve the quality of composition of Ground Battle lineups in Simulator to remove the issue of the same vehicles facing each other?

 

Technically it is impossible to make the ground vehicles of one nation fighting on two teams at once. Currently there is a mechanic that allows you to query the location of an ally and so allows you to determine if you have an ally or enemy in front of you. In addition the vehicles of different nations have different camouflages and in the case of Italian tanks also additional identification marks which also helps to determine the ownership of the vehicle. We don’t plan to remove similar vehicles from the setups because players who are researching specific game nation trees will simply lose the opportunity to play in SB mode."

 

https://warthunder.com/en/news/6818-qa-answers-from-the-developers-en

Edited by Nightwolf_
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6 hours ago, Potatoman530 said:

-1 copy paste is bad needs to stop sim is full of people who will use Vehicles like this to ruin it Gaijin wont ban these from Sim so as of now I don't want it added 

Ask for a sim matchmaker rework then. 

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1 hour ago, Nicholas_Concu said:

Ask for a sim matchmaker rework then. 

once we get our match maker reworked I will reconsider my vote. For now it remains "NO" but to be fair - even with MM reworked I'd most likely vote NO. I do not want devs to waste time on useless (from my perspective) vehicle and focus more on something that affects me

Edited by przybysz86
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Just now, przybysz86 said:

once we get our match maker reworked I will reconsider my vote. For now it remains "NO"

Then you’re barking at the wrong tree. You should be pushing for more vehicles and better gameplay instead of no vehicles and no gameplay. 

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3 minutes ago, Nicholas_Concu said:

Then you’re barking at the wrong tree. You should be pushing for more vehicles and better gameplay instead of no vehicles and no gameplay. 

as per my edit: if we assume IT M8 will never be added to SB match making (which right now is stupid assumption) then my vote is still NO because from my perspective it takes devs time that would otherwise be better spent on improving game modes I play

EDIT:

And even if I play RB sometimes - I am still against copy pasta :)

Edited by przybysz86
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4 hours ago, Nicholas_Concu said:

Then you’re barking at the wrong tree. You should be pushing for more vehicles and better gameplay instead of no vehicles and no gameplay. 

More vehicles doesn't equal better gameplay. Depends kinda on vehicles themselves, but still adding another copy-pasta isn't improving gameplay.

More vehicles = more toys to play, to grind. But this is not "gameplay".

You sound like you think that ONLY new vehicles are the ONLY way of improving gameplay. Like: no matter what will be improved - if it's not containing new vehicles, it's not an improvement.

 

You know what would be "improving gameplay"?

Working on Ground EC.

Working on attack/defence mode, that may would look similiar to Heroes&Generals' Assault gamemode, or Day of Infamy's Invasion gamemode. Maybe to merge this idea into EC.

Instead of domination, by capping magic circles, pointlessly thrown on map, it would really require some BRAIN instead of just mouse-aim reflex.

Current game mode requires only little of brain - it's CS:GO with tanks, not REAL tank gamemode.

Working on better maps than another [email protected] city map. Or "open" map, with village/castle in the center and overfilled with excessive density of hills and trees - like Kuban:

Working on that ridiculous, unrealistic APHE and AP mechanics, at least for SB. Although i don't think it will be able to be properly implemented without some "morale" system, as in reality -unlike in WT- tankers were't fighting till the last tanker. Leaving a tank in panic, even if no round penetrated it, wasn't that unique. Game could use some simplicity of this, but still a single round with barely 60-80 grams of explosives, packed -unlike hand grenades- in KILOGRAMS of steel (that round basically is) killing entire crew is a fantasy. Fantasy, that people are believing, because of how's game shows it.

Ask Godman_82

 

We want that game to be closer to reality. However, do not exaggerate of what i'm saying by "closer to reality".

Vehicles are mostly fine. Their model, damage model, armor, modules, crew, all these systems in game, etc. are fine enough. Improvement in PROPER DIRECTION (towards reality and away from arcade/WoT 2.0) wouldn't hurt and it would be even required, as more and more modern vehicles are added, as game grows. Some things that works for differently made modern vehicles should be made in order to make these vehicles work like IRL they had.

But definitely this game REQUIRES something MORE than just "nothing more than new vehicles".

Why would you need more and more of vehicles, that would play totally the same thing, on the same maps, that always requires of capping the same circles that are always between two teams.

Game WOULD be more interesting, if things were pushed in right direction.

 

btw. It's the GAME that needs rework, not just matchmaker (whose the only role is to gather awaiting players and create a battle - the same unimproved battle that requires capping circles. It chooses map and players, but matchmaker alone isn't MAKING maps, gamemodes and improvements).

Edited by Nightwolf_
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No thanks. This vehicle is totally not needed since there aready is the AB43 with 47mm

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   I don't see why it's needed since Italy has a lot of its own potential (+ ones which are already in the game) wheeled vehicles including for low tier. The only way I see it in the ITT is as a reward for some event on Liberation Day or Republic Day or National Unity and Armed Forces Day, like an ultra rare vehicle.

  If it had smth special in postwar service, like missiles or recoilless rifle it could be nice XD

Like this lol

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16 hours ago, BlueBeta said:

No thanks. This vehicle is totally not needed since there aready is the AB43 with 47mm

For once I'm in total agreement with this sentiment. The AB43 is one of my favorite vehicles in the Italian tree, and it doesn't need a lend-lease suppliment, unless we get the dog. I just really, really want the dog.

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