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Ballistic charts for guns?


Hello, in previous game I played there was something similar to warthunder wikipedia and we had balistic charts for all guns. What if we added them to all machineguns and cannons? Not sure if guns in warthunder are 1:1 to realism or they are buffed/weakened and if players will actually value those kind of informations. 


Something like this:
Zeroing-At-Or-Most-Recommended-Distance-

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I'm not sure how this would be useful for WT.

 

You would always zero to whatever is the range of your enemy and if you fall short you increase the distance and if you overshoot you lower the distance. The path it takes to get there doesn't really matter unless you're trying to lob it over a rock or something.

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3 hours ago, blastedryan said:

I'm not sure how this would be useful for WT.

 

You would always zero to whatever is the range of your enemy and if you fall short you increase the distance and if you overshoot you lower the distance. The path it takes to get there doesn't really matter unless you're trying to lob it over a rock or something.


Would be nice to see difference between cannons/machineguns. I would not like to play boats with canon that shoot to the moon to hit target 2km away. Also if airplane/tank have cannons and/or machineguns with different velocity would be nice to see difference between them. 
 

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  • 2 weeks later...

I think it'd be a nice addition just for the ability to visualise the difference between rounds (for example between HESH and APDS, or between AP and APCBC).

 

The problem comes from actually getting reliable values for it all, and the scaling of the graph. Low tier vehicles don't tend to engage at extreme ranges, while high tier vehicles often engage past 2km. However, you'd want a consistent scale so you can directly compare vehicles to each other.

 

You'd probably have to manually test the trajectories of rounds, unless someone knows a way to pull ranged dropoff from the game data.

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4 hours ago, ftsartek said:

You'd probably have to manually test the trajectories of rounds, unless someone knows a way to pull ranged dropoff from the game data.

 

THere's a variable called "Effective Distance" which is how far a shell or a bullet can travel in  a more or less flat trajectory. However, I don't know if this is modeled for anything other than aircraft guns.

 

Other than that, I guess there's muzzle velocity

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@GunFetish I am surprised to see a similar thread on this forum. This game is pretty casual, even RB/SB and 99% of people here dont research this stuff that deeply. But I just happened to be a part of the 1% that does. 

Long ago I have built a mathematical model of the shell flight. WT makes several simplifications that made this much easier than it would've been IRL. For once, it disregards the drag, the shells keep the muzzle velocity all the way to the end. Here is an example: a shell with muzzle velocity of 750m/s (Panzer IV gun) will not go over 0,7m over the target (the height of the turret for many tanks in the game if you are aiming at the turret ring) if you zero.in your gun at the distance of approximately 550m, between point blanc and that distance.

I have tested this plenty both in test drive and in actual combat.

 

image.png.316301242fe8208a928dcf1bf8b7b3

 

@KillaKiwi come, have a look, you might find this interesting.

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30 minutes ago, Peasant_wb said:

@GunFetish I am surprised to see a similar thread on this forum. This game is pretty casual, even RB/SB and 99% of people here dont research this stuff that deeply. But I just happened to be a part of the 1% that does. 

Long ago I have built a mathematical model of the shell flight. WT makes several simplifications that made this much easier than it would've been IRL. For once, it disregards the drag, the shells keep the muzzle velocity all the way to the end. Here is an example: a shell with muzzle velocity of 750m/s (Panzer IV gun) will not go over 0,7m over the target (the height of the turret for many tanks in the game if you are aiming at the turret ring) if you zero.in your gun at the distance of approximately 550m, between point blanc and that distance.

I have tested this plenty both in test drive and in actual combat.

 

image.png.316301242fe8208a928dcf1bf8b7b3

 

@KillaKiwi come, have a look, you might find this interesting.

 

Mind passing along the deets of the specific quadratic formula used?

Also, how does one account for elevation using that formula?

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18 hours ago, Aussie_Mantis said:

 

THere's a variable called "Effective Distance" which is how far a shell or a bullet can travel in  a more or less flat trajectory. However, I don't know if this is modeled for anything other than aircraft guns.

 

Other than that, I guess there's muzzle velocity

 

There are a few factors that come into play; the round's aerodynamic qualities (drag coefficient), and muzzle velocity are probably the most pertinent. Round mass does play a part as well, as the more massive the round the more gravity will affect it. Unfortunately I can't find any information about drag coefficients in the game files, despite velocity and mass being easy to find.

 

16 hours ago, Aussie_Mantis said:

 

Mind passing along the deets of the specific quadratic formula used?

Also, how does one account for elevation using that formula?

 

In terms of this... I'm not sure how useful the graph actually is. I think the round falloff and range limits are more valuable in this case, especially since that formula is likely particular to the round/weapon in question (and it seems quite specific; this particular round will be over trajectory by 0.7m maximum on a 550m zero?). Assuming the elevation is the default elevation at 550m zero as well.

 

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3 hours ago, ftsartek said:

In terms of this... I'm not sure how useful the graph actually is. I think the round falloff and range limits are more valuable in this case, especially since that formula is likely particular to the round/weapon in question (and it seems quite specific; this particular round will be over trajectory by 0.7m maximum on a 550m zero?). Assuming the elevation is the default elevation at 550m zero as well.

 

Well, we do know the places where velocity falls off (datarips),so using a formula derived from that using a correlatory graph we can then use integral calculus to find the Distance function and thus the shape of the curve.

Edited by Aussie_Mantis
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The in-game gunsights do it for you, not sure why you'd really need it

 

On 12/11/2019 at 19:24, Peasant_wb said:

WT makes several simplifications that made this much easier than it would've been IRL. For once, it disregards the drag, the shells keep the muzzle velocity all the way to the end

 

not true, if this were the case, all equal muzzle-velocity shells would have the same trajectory (and thus range), but it is clearly not the case in-game: machinegun rounds drop off significantly beyond 1km and in naval forces, large caliber guns take a lot less time to land shots at long range

 

I don't know exactly how they model the drag, but the only free parameters are the drag coefficient and air density, though it's not too hard to come up with reasonable estimates for those

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 13/11/2019 at 01:24, Peasant_wb said:

...

WT makes several simplifications that made this much easier than it would've been IRL. For once, it disregards the drag, the shells keep the muzzle velocity all the way to the end.

...

How do you come to that conclusion?

 

 

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On 04/12/2019 at 07:16, *MiseryIndex556 said:

The ballistic charts would only be useful if you could adjust the sights. The main gun sights are already calibrated by distance, so you don't need to rely on drop charts. 


You can compare different velocities of weapons. If airplane have two types of machineguns you can compare bullet trajectories.

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 04/12/2019 at 16:16, *MiseryIndex556 said:

The ballistic charts would only be useful if you could adjust the sights. The main gun sights are already calibrated by distance, so you don't need to rely on drop charts. 

On 06/12/2019 at 00:40, GunFetish said:


You can compare different velocities of weapons. If airplane have two types of machineguns you can compare bullet trajectories.

 

In addition, it's useful to determine whether you can get deflection shots easily or not. HV guns are better at leading enemies while LV are better for straight-up head-to-head combat or going against thingies travelling in relatively straight, level, uniform trajectories.

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