Good to see some changes but a couple of questions.

 

The R3 T106 is now 13378 SL to repair for a light tank, Surely this is a mistake?

The Ho-Ri production is still very expensive for what it is.

And what does "Reward multipliers have been recalculated mean"? Have they gone up? Down? Side to side?

 

Thanks for the reply.

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High tier repair costs are still on the impractical side, with high tier props having repair costs over 12k and jets being even higher. This is giving players decreasing reward for moving up in the game.

 

Air RB is unbalanced and extremely buggy, with planes that drastically exceed or under-perform their real counterparts and carriers that are just as likely to kill you as let you fly

 

Tank RB has crappy formulas that break the game even more and US gets stomped at around 7.0, often facing better versions of their own tanks at the same BR

 

This game has all of these problems and then some, and although this patch fixed none of those above I have to give credit where it's due: the economy changes have made high tier accessible to me and thousands of others. The shells tanks depend on have costs lowered and I can finally get into jets and more top tier props in addition to modern-ish tanks. Keep up the good work: this is one of the best updates in years.:good:

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Sacrificing your playerbase in the name of 'balance' doesn't seem like a profitable strategy, Gaijin.  Many players will or have already bought GE to research the 2A5 due to the astronomical RP requirements.  Those players are not going to continue spending GE to buy SL to repair that tank, they're just going to play something else.

 

And that's not even 'balancing' the tank at all!  It's quite the opposite, really; now the owners of that tank will double down on camping, sniping, and using extremely cheap tactics in order to sit back and avoid repairs, and the tank's battle performance will -improve- because of that, to the detriment of team-based play.

And the battle performance doesn't go down when players just park the 2A5 in the garage because CAS will send the player back to the garage with nothing but an expensive repair bill.

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Is the low reward modifier of the Do 335 B2 intentional? 

I can't make SL with it anymore.

 

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11 hours ago, Smin1080p said:

 

Leopard 2A5's economic performance far exceeds that of its competitors. Its repair cost reflects its battle performance. 

Once again, we HATE this kind of balancing method.

What is up with the Ta 152's then?

Were they performing so well that they needed 26k repair?

Or the He 177? 42k spaded?

Why do you not manage to introduce Nato matchmaking Gaijin?

Making player abandon vehicles by strapping enourmous repair costs to them is NOT FAIR.

This is awful treatment of customers

Edited by NoodleCup31
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AWSOME! Best thing to happen to WT in a long time. But why are the American T32 and Lorraine 40t repair costs 16k? That is 4 times as much as the IS3. Will this be reduced in a coming update?

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Now I know Gaijin is not perfect and they do mistakes like any other human (but hell, they are at least working on them to improve, as we see in this patch)

 

But you people must realize that game design is not easy and especially in balancing quasi-historical performances of hundreds of vehicles. Perfect balance will and cannot ever be achieved. 

Personally I think it's fine, sometimes I don't mind playing the underdog. Challenge is not always fun bit it might be.

 

So saying don't introduce in-game until it has counterpart is stupid - what, for all techttees? So we may wait for Japanese and Italian Tunguska? This way some vehicles may NEVER be introduced. Sometimes, a vehicle simply does not have a counterpart. 

 

Balancing with BR change instead of repair cost - again, not always possible. Some vehicles wouldn't survive BR increase, and yet they are too good on current BR. I know that some of the repair cost may seem insane, some of those are maybe a bug or forgotten but in some cases, as I've always suspected and devs now confirmed, they are deliberate and people still play those expensive vehicles regularly and efficiently. I know this is frustrating for an average player that just wants to play some country, like France but when I saw what some YouTubers do with certain vehicles I understand that it's not easy to balance out the extremes. 

Edited by Thorien_Kell
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11 hours ago, Smin1080p said:

Leopard 2A5's economic performance far exceeds that of its competitors. Its repair cost reflects its battle performance. 

 

well then, shouldn't the AH-1Z and uss brooklyn both cost 100k per vehicle, on this basis? :crazy:

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12 hours ago, Smin1080p said:

 

Leopard 2A5's economic performance far exceeds that of its competitors. Its repair cost reflects its battle performance. 

If its battle performance exceeds every other tank, then the solution is to change its BR. I don't mind German teams experiencing what American teams had to with the Abrams, but if vehicles are all at the same BR but have vastly different battle performance, then the problem is the BR. 

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While this update had good intentions,( the reduction of vehicle costs was very welcomed, thank you Gaijin for this! :) ) it came as yet another win/loose type scenario, this time once more with Jet aircraft from multiple nations being absolutely obliterated with beyond excessive repair costs.

 

I can understand the repair change in regards to Tank battles, Close Air Support is the bane of most tankers regardless of their skill. for this mode I would agree with these costs (although still a bit too high) however those who have enjoyed Air Realistic mode are going to suffer immeasurably as even with premium, it would take someone a Guaranteed 2 kills just to pay off the repair (the Cougar for example has a 15k repair now, with around 10k per kill earnings) every match to turn a profit, both the Jet bombers in the American branch are now redundant, the repair now exceeds the gain of the aircraft with a full load or ordinance if you are F2P (as in, if you don't own premium you will almost never make any profit with bomb placement.) even with premium to pay off repair is immensely difficult.

 

I used to Fly only Air RB, and have been for almost 5 years, but as of the previous economy update I was forced into tank battles just to turn decent profits, now with this update not a single jet is worth less than 10k in the American branch, all but one being the premium F-86 (this move by Gaijin could not be a more transparent example of pushing purchase of premium content) as it is the only reasonably priced vehicle for the tier.

 

Tanks however received a very positive change (apart from the leopard 2A5 fans who will need to see counselling after the 20k repair :D ) but could still be a lot better, they are still just a little bit too high for the reward rate. but non the less a huge improvement!

 

In the future, a better solution would be to introduce separate repair costs dependant on game mode ( B-57 may be 26k in tank battles, but only 6k in regular Air battles, this way high tier  aviators can fly the vehicles they love unhindered and tank plays needn't worry about being nuked from orbit. and to rework reward rates, in discussing rewards with fellow players across numerous matches today, very few can determine the difference between Tier 4 battle rewards VS Tier 6 and 7, seeing late tier rewards amplified by an additional 25% would be adequate of both effort and scale, as at the moment Tier 4 vehicles earn almost just as much as tier 6-7 ( my premium M46 makes 11k lions from zone capture, My XM-1 makes 11,600~ lions for same action despite being a whole two tiers above)

 

     

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Great change, a tad overdue but really great.  Just wanted to bring to your attention that the RP cost of modules for the Japanese AAA the Type 87 has only been changed for some modules.  From what i can see the new lower RP costs have been implemented for the following modules: Parts, FPE, Crew, Horizontal drive and the ammunition, all the other modules are exactly the same RP cost as before this change.  Please pass this on and get it fixed quickly, i was really looking forward to using this vehicle, thanks.

 

Added this screen shot, you can see the RP costs for tier 1 is correctly changed at 8,100 per modification.  RP costs for tier 2 are 22,000 when it should be more like 9,000 per modification.  RP costs for tier 3 should be 10,000 but filters, elevation and smoke are all unchanged at the old RP costs of 31,000 each.  Similarly tier 4 modifications all cost 40,000 RP, the old cost, except the ammunition belt DM23 which is at the correct RP cost of 13,000.

 

Please pass onto developers, thanks.

RP for mods type 87.png

Edited by HammarOfGod
added the image of rp costs and text
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Praise be to the snail overlords! Now we just need that top tier decompression and this game will be quite nice, although I do question some of the changes like the 35k repair cost to the a6m5 otsu. Overall great update.

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is it my fault that i play german ground vehicles? Time passing by and i find it more and more difficult, to have a lltle fun playing german tree..

first lowering their performace and now triple the repair cost!!!!! Better remove that tech tree!

I need to know if the repair cost of german top rank tanks have a bug, or are they real!?

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Amazed they lowered the RP so much. A much welcome change.
Are there still issues with the game? Yes. but can we just stop to appreciate they cut RP costs by like 50%???
I would have expected 20-25% at best.

But it figures a few days ago I spend a day + grinding some 8.0 + tanks out. And even broke down and used some GE to boost like 200K RP and get parts. Then it gets cut in half haha.
Just my luck. But not really complaining as it's a good thing still.
 

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Gaijin please! Look at the video you just released about the French tanks, please look at 100% of the comment from people who want to play them but simply can't because of the insane price you put on those vehicules, please try to understand that you are still way too high with some tier 4/5/6, it is just impossible to get positive Sl even after a good game, you always say you listen the community but this is the proof that you don't do it, look at all the comments on the video, everyone complaining about the repairs, the amx 30 1972 4 time more expensive than leo 1... Why?

Do us a favor and read those comments instead of closing the comment section and fix those issues, at the time of low br from lorraine 40t and such i could maybe understand but now they took 2 time the BR nerf, their price can go down, you don't treat all tank with autoloader the same way (ex russian tanks, japanese...) so why those prices?

Really hope you review them a second time.

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20 hours ago, k4mik4dze said:

E100 is not on the list but repair was change from 26k to 31k ... More like a sidegrade to  MAUS but cost 5 times more. I can't understand this 

 

The E-100 is an extremely rare prize that was only rewarded to tournament winners. Thus the only people that own it, tend to be at the higher end of the skill range and are playing the machine very well. The Maus is a machine open to anyone and is also far more numerically present in the game than the E-100 (as its a very limited and rare hidden event vehicle).

 

2 hours ago, unwinder66 said:

Gaijin please! Look at the video you just released about the French tanks, please look at 100% of the comment from people who want to play them but simply can't because of the insane price you put on those vehicules, please try to understand that you are still way too high with some tier 4/5/6, it is just impossible to get positive Sl even after a good game, you always say you listen the community but this is the proof that you don't do it, look at all the comments on the video, everyone complaining about the repairs, the amx 30 1972 4 time more expensive than leo 1... Why?

Do us a favor and read those comments instead of closing the comment section and fix those issues, at the time of low br from lorraine 40t and such i could maybe understand but now they took 2 time the BR nerf, their price can go down, you don't treat all tank with autoloader the same way (ex russian tanks, japanese...) so why those prices?

Really hope you review them a second time.

 

We are aware of the comments. Indeed we do listen to feedback, but there are many reasons why those machines have the cost they do. 

 

French vehicles tend to be far more efficient than some of their counterparts from other nations are are particularly competitive around Rank IV. Typically they are much more proficient in battle and also last longer in battle than many of their rivals. 

 

Its also worth pointing out that some French vehicles were indeed reduced this update.  

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12 minutes ago, Smin1080p said:

We are aware of the comments. Indeed we do listen to feedback, but there are many reasons why those machines have the cost they do. 

 

French vehicles tend to be far more efficient than some of their counterparts from other nations are are particularly competitive around Rank IV. Typically they are much more proficient in battle and also last longer in battle than many of their rivals. 

 

Its also worth pointing out that some French vehicles were indeed reduced this update.  

 

There are many other vehicules with 65/70% win rate most of them doesn't have repair cost that high, can't you guys work on br instead? The tree already lack some competitive vehicules and the only few good ones we got have been hamered with crazy prices, if we had other opportunity i would understand but with a logic like this you are simply blocking most of the people who want to try the French tree, it is not appealing for them, there were some great reduction but the worse hamered tanks are still very high to repair, even the amx 10 rc got increased while not performing good at all, so the excuse of "vehicule is too good it has to cost a lot" is wrong, if not why the centauro which is far better cost around the same?

It feels like you cherry pick some tanks that you dislike instead of giving us good reason, again most of the tanks we are talking about were nerfed few times br wise in the past, now they are high enough to get their price lowered, Not talking 50% less here but a good 20/30% more reduction would be really welcome, try them, try to see how negative you are in each battle, it's impossible.

Let's hope you review this a little bit.

 

Respectfully.

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23 minutes ago, Smin1080p said:

 

The E-100 is an extremely rare prize that was only rewarded to tournament winners. Thus the only people that own it, tend to be at the higher end of the skill range and are playing the machine very well. The Maus is a machine open to anyone and is also far more numerically present in the game than the E-100 (as its a very limited and rare hidden event vehicle).

 

 

We are aware of the comments. Indeed we do listen to feedback, but there are many reasons why those machines have the cost they do. 

 

French vehicles tend to be far more efficient than some of their counterparts from other nations are are particularly competitive around Rank IV. Typically they are much more proficient in battle and also last longer in battle than many of their rivals. 

 

Its also worth pointing out that some French vehicles were indeed reduced this update.  

I don’t get why the E100 costs that much, it feels like it is punishment for playing the game well. It’s not balancing the machine, it is preventing players from playing their reward vehicle. I can guarantee that the players that have it do equally well or even better in ever single other vehicle. I’m sure an algorithm set this cost, but I think it is missing part of the picture.

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6 hours ago, Smin1080p said:

 

The E-100 is an extremely rare prize that was only rewarded to tournament winners. Thus the only people that own it, tend to be at the higher end of the skill range and are playing the machine very well. The Maus is a machine open to anyone and is also far more numerically present in the game than the E-100 (as its a very limited and rare hidden event vehicle). 

 

 

We are aware of the comments. Indeed we do listen to feedback, but there are many reasons why those machines have the cost they do. 

 

French vehicles tend to be far more efficient than some of their counterparts from other nations are are particularly competitive around Rank IV. Typically they are much more proficient in battle and also last longer in battle than many of their rivals. 

 

Its also worth pointing out that some French vehicles were indeed reduced this update.  

Doesn't this create a positive feedback loop of increasing cost though?

If repair costs rise to an extreme level above 10k, then only those who do well can play it for an extended period of time without bankrupting themselves. If only people who can do well are able to play a nation's vehicles, these expensive ones will do better than cheap vehicles anybody can use regardless of skill, and thus their price rises, raising the bar for profitability even higher and refining the player base even more so upwards. A nation like France with very low player numbers and not as many iconic vehicles to attract 1st time players will be significantly more susceptible to this kind of self feedback loop than say USA or Germany. I wonder if the high repair costs aren't actually caused by good performance, but rather the good performance is caused by the repair costs.

1153377620_circleofoof.png.e3a4d7b2bf697

 

That thought out of the way, I'm really happy with all the other changes in this update, these adjustments will help to ease the grind at high tiers and level the playing field for people just starting the game now. Shell cost reductions are also awesome in general. Good stuff!

 

Edited by Aerobane
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50 minutes ago, unwinder66 said:

 

There are many other vehicules with 65/70% win rate most of them doesn't have repair cost that high, can't you guys work on br instead? The tree already lack some competitive vehicules and the only few good ones we got have been hamered with crazy prices, if we had other opportunity i would understand but with a logic like this you are simply blocking most of the people who want to try the French tree, it is not appealing for them, there were some great reduction but the worse hamered tanks are still very high to repair, even the amx 10 rc got increased while not performing good at all, so the excuse of "vehicule is too good it has to cost a lot" is wrong, if not why the centauro which is far better cost around the same?

It feels like you cherry pick some tanks that you dislike instead of giving us good reason, again most of the tanks we are talking about were nerfed few times br wise in the past, now they are high enough to get their price lowered, Not talking 50% less here but a good 20/30% more reduction would be really welcome, try them, try to see how negative you are in each battle, it's impossible.

Let's hope you review this a little bit.

 

Respectfully.

 

W/R is but one of many factors and not a very telling one in terms of the big picture as it can be influenced by many other factors. 

 

We do indeed work on BR, but raising the BR of many of the French vehicles being discussed would lead to them being simply outclassed as they would face greater opponents. 

 

Im sorry to say that even machines like the AMX-10RC are indeed being used proficiently, hence why the cost goes up.

 

We do not simply pick and choose vehicles because we "dislike" them, it is done so based on logical and algorithms from the simple facts of data. Of course feedback is also a key part (as evident by the bulk of this update), but if a vehicle is getting higher costs thats simply because it is indeed doing well and a BR change is not applicable in that instance. 

 

46 minutes ago, *BATTLEIRON13 said:

I don’t get why the E100 costs that much, it feels like it is punishment for playing the game well. It’s not balancing the machine, it is preventing players from playing their reward vehicle. I can guarantee that the players that have it do equally well or even better in ever single other vehicle. I’m sure an algorithm set this cost, but I think it is missing part of the picture.

 

Again as I explained, its because the vehicle is being played so well and so proficiently that the cost has risen.

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