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BeowulfDW

Suggestion for an American Heavy Fighter/Interceptor line

The Aviation research trees of the various nations represented in War Thunder are generally sorted into lines based on manufacturer (Mitsubishi, Messerschmitt, Supermarine, Yakovlev, etc.) or on function (naval fighter, attacker, bomber, etc.).  Additionally, most of the "Big Five" (USA, UK, Germany, USSR, Japan) have their aircraft divided into 5 lines of progression in accordance with these categories.  This allows for a smoother transition from one plane to the next, generally speaking.  A player that has used a Spitfire Mk V to unlock the Spitfire Mk IX has a good foundation of knowledge and experience regarding what to expect of his or her new plane.  It is here that the American research tree sticks out like a sore thumb.  First, it has only 4 lines of progression instead of the usual 5. Secondly, the heavy fighters are crammed together with the regular land-based fighters in a single tree. 

 

My suggestion is that the American land-based fighter line be divided into a fighter line and a heavy fighter/interceptor/strike fighter line by taking the P-38 variants, P-47 variants, the F-82, the P-61, the F7F, and the F-84 variants and placing them into their own progression line.  The most important benefit from this change would be a less eclectic progression in the American tech tree.  While the lighter American fighters (P-40s, P-63s, P-51s and such) all have their own quirks, I think it's safe to say that they are more similar to one another in terms of performance and game-play than they are to their heavier stablemates.  This same principle also works for the heavier fighters: progressing from a P-38 to the P-61 (or to another P-38) will be much less jarring a transition than going from a P-63 to a P-61.  Another benefit would be a much less cluttered looking tech tree.  A minor difference, to be sure, but certainly an improvement.  The last possible benefit I'd like to point out is related to the previous one: a new tech tree would allow for the introduction of new planes without further cluttering of the land-based American fighter line.  Planes like the P-35 and the P-47C could be added to flesh out the beginning of the new fighter line, while the F-84F could be added as the capstone to the line.

 

If you took the time to read this whole suggestion, I thank you for your time.  It ended up being a bit more verbose that I intended.

Edited by BeowulfDW
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A suggestion to be sure, but a welcome one.

 

I quite like this, it would also help better split US players into their respective skills.

 

Energy fighters/heavy fighter pilots can grind their way up the Tech tree without interruptions and the higher performance/fighter pilots can pass on through unabated by "Clunky twin engines".

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1 hour ago, janderson01 said:

A suggestion to be sure, but a welcome one.

 

I quite like this, it would also help better split US players into their respective skills.

 

Energy fighters/heavy fighter pilots can grind their way up the Tech tree without interruptions and the higher performance/fighter pilots can pass on through unabated by "Clunky twin engines".

 

Precisely.  And thank you for your support (at least that's how I'm interpreting the "welcome" bit).

 

I have to admit, though, that I'm unsure as to whether or not the P-47s should be included in the new line.  While I feel it's the right move (they were the largest and heaviest single-engine fighters of WW2) an argument could be made that they still belong in the main fighter line.  Your thoughts?

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You have my support bar the F7F. This should be a USAF/USAAF heavy fighter & fighter-bomber line, so naval fighters should be excluded. The F7F should retain its placement in the USN line, but be moved in front of the Bearcats. 

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I have a similar suggestion for this as well. The U.S tech tree looks so unorganized when looking at the Russian and German tech tree...

 

 

 

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17 hours ago, Aquilachrysaetos said:

You have my support bar the F7F. This should be a USAF/USAAF heavy fighter & fighter-bomber line, so naval fighters should be excluded. The F7F should retain its placement in the USN line, but be moved in front of the Bearcats. 

 

I included it in the suggestion mostly to provide this hypothetical new line with a super-prop, and also because the Tigercat is unique among Naval props, due to being (so far as I'm aware) the only carrier-based heavy fighter in the game.  It is likely to retain that honor until or if we get the Sea Hornet.

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I suppose there could be some merit to splitting up the USAAF fighter line in particular into a "light" fighter line (P-36s, P-40s, P-39s, P-63s, P-51s etc.) and a "heavy" fighter line (P-38s, P-47s, P-61s, F-82s etc.).

 

Here's what I'd guess an eventual result would look like (including some aircraft that aren't in-game, just for hypothetical reasons - aircraft not in the game will be denoted with italics)

 

Rank 1

P-26s (Reserve)

   \/

P-36A                      P-35

P-36C                     P-35A

   \/                             \/

P-36G                      P-70

 

Rank 2

P-40B                    P-38-LO

   \/                             \/

P-40E-1                  P-38E

   \/                             \/

P-40F-10               P-38G-1

   \/                             \/

P-400                    P-47C-5

P-39N-0

P-39Q-5

 

Rank 3

P-51                    P-47D-22

P-51A                       \/

   \/                       P-47D-25

P-51B                       \/

   \/                       P-47D-28

P-63A-5                    \/

P-63A-10              P-61B-15

   \/                        P-61C-1

P-63C-5

 

Rank 4    

P-51D-5                P-38J-15

    \/                     P-38L-5-LO

P-51D-30                  \/

    \/                       P-47N-15

P-51H-5-NA               \/

    \/                         F-82B

P-51H-10-NA             \/

                               F-82E

                               F-82G

 

Rank 5

F-80A-5                F-84B-26

F-80C-10                   \/

    \/                    F-84G-21-RE

F-86A-5                     \/

    \/                         F-89B

F-86F-25                   \/

    \/                         F-84F

F-86F-2

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All seems fine to me tbfh. 

 

While I do have a thing for attack planes & bombers as many of you all know, heavy fighters for me have been a very mixed bag. Though maybe after the cannon buff there is actual reason to seriously fly out the P-61 and P-38s that have been otherwise languishing in my tech tree.

 

Because besides hunting bombers, I actually can’t figure out how to fly P-38s correctly. They accelerate like a bat outta hell, have lowish top dive speeds, climb really well, turn okayish to good in short bursts, and now actually have good armament.

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On 17/07/2018 at 06:53, MH4UAstragon said:

All seems fine to me tbfh. 

 

While I do have a thing for attack planes & bombers as many of you all know, heavy fighters for me have been a very mixed bag. Though maybe after the cannon buff there is actual reason to seriously fly out the P-61 and P-38s that have been otherwise languishing in my tech tree.

 

Because besides hunting bombers, I actually can’t figure out how to fly P-38s correctly. They accelerate like a bat outta hell, have lowish top dive speeds, climb really well, turn okayish to good in short bursts, and now actually have good armament.

May I suggest the German heavy fighters as a start?  They're in the bomber-killing business, and business is booming!

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On 17/07/2018 at 03:53, MH4UAstragon said:

All seems fine to me tbfh. 

 

While I do have a thing for attack planes & bombers as many of you all know, heavy fighters for me have been a very mixed bag. Though maybe after the cannon buff there is actual reason to seriously fly out the P-61 and P-38s that have been otherwise languishing in my tech tree.

 

Because besides hunting bombers, I actually can’t figure out how to fly P-38s correctly. They accelerate like a bat outta hell, have lowish top dive speeds, climb really well, turn okayish to good in short bursts, and now actually have good armament.

They had good armament even before the cannon buff (AN/MX cannons really didn't need the buff, and it has the 4 fifty cals).

 

On 15/07/2018 at 15:50, BeowulfDW said:

The Aviation research trees of the various nations represented in War Thunder are generally sorted into lines based on manufacturer (Mitsubishi, Messerschmitt, Supermarine, Yakovlev, etc.) or on function (naval fighter, attacker, bomber, etc.).  Additionally, most of the "Big Five" (USA, UK, Germany, USSR, Japan) have their aircraft divided into 5 lines of progression in accordance with these categories.  This allows for a smoother transition from one plane to the next, generally speaking.  A player that has used a Spitfire Mk V to unlock the Spitfire Mk IX has a good foundation of knowledge and experience regarding what to expect of his or her new plane.  It is here that the American research tree sticks out like a sore thumb.  First, it has only 4 lines of progression instead of the usual 5. Secondly, the heavy fighters are crammed together with the regular land-based fighters in a single tree. 

 

My suggestion is that the American land-based fighter line be divided into a fighter line and a heavy fighter/interceptor/strike fighter line by taking the P-38 variants, P-47 variants, the F-82, the P-61, the F7F, and the F-84 variants and placing them into their own progression line.  The most important benefit from this change would be a less eclectic progression in the American tech tree.  While the lighter American fighters (P-40s, P-63s, P-51s and such) all have their own quirks, I think it's safe to say that they are more similar to one another in terms of performance and game-play than they are to their heavier stablemates.  This same principle also works for the heavier fighters: progressing from a P-38 to the P-61 (or to another P-38) will be much less jarring a transition than going from a P-63 to a P-61.  Another benefit would be a much less cluttered looking tech tree.  A minor difference, to be sure, but certainly an improvement.  The last possible benefit I'd like to point out is related to the previous one: a new tech tree would allow for the introduction of new planes without further cluttering of the land-based American fighter line.  Planes like the P-35 and the P-47C could be added to flesh out the beginning of the new fighter line, while the F-84F could be added as the capstone to the line.

 

If you took the time to read this whole suggestion, I thank you for time.  It ended up being a bit more verbose that I intended.

Either

A. Leave the P-38's out of this lineup as it is more of a normal fighter than a heavy fighter, or

B. Put the P-39's and P-63's along in with them, as they are interceptors as well.  Otherwise, I fully support this.

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On 26/07/2018 at 00:06, Ska_King_Felix said:

Either

A. Leave the P-38's out of this lineup as it is more of a normal fighter than a heavy fighter, or

B. Put the P-39's and P-63's along in with them, as they are interceptors as well.  Otherwise, I fully support this.

A. Both the P-38 and the P-47 blur that particular line.  With the exception of the P-61, hardly any American heavy fighter really behaves like a "typical" heavy fighter.  Also, leaving the P-38s out would lead to a very sparse progression line, indeed, at least at the moment.

B. While I acknowledge that the P-39s were indeed designed initially as interceptors, that's not exactly what they ended up being after the removal of their turbos.  The whole point of my suggestion was to create a less eclectic experience while progressing down the fighter lines by putting the heavier American fighters in one line, and putting the lighter ones in another.  Including lighter fighters in with those heavier renders my suggestion moot.  Please keep in mind that I'm suggesting a Twin-engine/Heavy/Strike fighter line, not an interceptor line.

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I'd support something like this idea being added.  The progress one currently makes down the U.S. Army Air fighter tree is certainly strange to say the least.

Edited by Milocat
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