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Battle Rating changes (July 2018) (Updated 11.07.2018)


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Ok, we updated the tables after checking the feedback from this thread and similar thread on RU forum. No ETA on when it goes live, but it will be soon™.

Again, thank you for all the feedback, it was really great to see all the constructive discussion in your posts!

If you cannot find the changes you were asking for, do not lose your hopes :) We are constantly working on BRs and another changes will be announced soon™ (but later than previous soon™ ;)

 

 

Few additional tips (and advice for those who cannot find their posts approved):

Please:

  • Less salt :crab:
  • Edit your posts, do not post few times in row or few times every few hours. Use multiquote [(+) button under post]. We often need to get back few pages to check if new post made by same user contains new feedback, or same thing just typed in different way. It slows the process of gathering the data.
  • No insults towards dev team or players. Like for real, who needs this? No one care what you think on players who use ABCD vehicle. 
  • Focus on BRs. This thread is not to discuss economy, module changes and bugs.
  • When you think on BRs, you need to do it for fully spaded vehicle (maxed machine with all the modules unlocked). It's hard to get spade for some of them? Sorry, but still we have one BR for each vehicle and AFAIK we do not have plans to implement different BR for stock/spaded vehicle.
  • Focus on actual BR, not uptier/downtier situation. For example some of you support feedback ONLY for down/up tier situations which is not the best and most common scenario.
  • We do not care on thunderskill stats. We have all the stats we need from our game servers (from 100% of playerbase, not from some small part of it). Suggestions made on thunderskill stats are not taken under consideration here. If your only argument is "thunderskill stats shows that" try to find something else as a support please.

 

Thread will still be unlocked so you can discuss it, but if you want to discuss specific vehicle with someone, please do it in Machines of War section.

 

Once again, thank you for your hard work with posting all the feedback in such clear and civil way :good:

 

 

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We are implementing planned BR changes for ground vehicles and aircraft. This time we have paid special attention to modern ground vehicles and very efficient “pre-top” machines such as the Chieftain Mk.3 and Leopard A1A1 with stabilizer and powerful ammo.

 

These changes will allow less efficient and modern vehicles to meet far more superior opponents less often and will not disrupt the balance of top rank battles.

 

Economy changes will be implemented later this week.

 

 
 
 
  Aircraft Battles
  Arcade Realistic Simulator
  was now was now was now
XF5F 3.3 3.0 - - 3.3 3.0
N1K1 3.0 2.7 - - - -
VB.10C-1 4.0 3.7 - - - -
Do 335 A-1 5.3 5.0 - - 5.7 5.3
J2M3 5.0 5.3 - - - -
G.56 5.7 6.0 5.3 5.7 - -
Kikka 6.3 6.7 - - - -
Attacker FB.1 8.0 7.7 - - - -
TBD-1 - - 1.7 1.3 - -
Ki-45 otsu - - 2.7 2.3 - -
Breda 88 (P.XI) - - 2.0 1.7 - -
He 112 A-0 - - 2.0 1.7 - -
C.205 serie 3 - - 3.7 4.0 - -
A7M2 - - 5.0 5.3 4.0 4.3
Ki-84 hei - - 6.0 6.3 - -
Yak-23 - - 7.7 8.0 - -
F9F-2 - - 9.0 8.0 - -
Pе-3 - - - - 3.0 2.7
Ki-96 - - - - 4.0 3.7
Ki-108 - - - - 4.0 3.7
Ki-109 - - - - 4.7 4.3
I-185 - - - - 4.3 4.0
Bf 109 G-14/AS - - - - 5.0 5.3
Fw 190 A-8 - - - - 5.3 5.0
AD-4 (France) - - 5.7 6.0 - -
Sea Fury FB.11 - - 5.7 5.3 - -
Tempest Mk.II - - 6.3 6.0 - -
Seafire FR.47 - - 6.0 5.7 - -
             
  Mixed Battles
  Arcade Realistic Simulator
  was now was now was now
Т-64А (1971) 9 9.3 9 9.3 9 9.3
T-64B 9.3 9.7 9.3 9.7 9.3 9.7
T-62 8 8.3 8 8.3 8 8.3
T-62M-1 9 9.3 9 9.3 9 9.3
Pz.II F 1 1.3 1 1.3 1 1.3
Brummbär 5 4.7 5 4.7 5 4.7
T26E1-1 6.7 6.3 6.7 6.3 6.7 6.3
M3A1 (USMC) 1.3 1.7 1.7 2 1.3 2
M3A1 Stuart 1.3 1.7 1.7 2 1.3 2
XM-803 8.7 9 8.7 9 8.7 9
M1 Abrams 9.7 10 9.7 10 9.7 10
M60A1 RISE (P) 8.7 9 8.7 9 8.7 9
MBT-70 9 9.3 9 9.3 9 9.3
Leopard A1A1 8.3 9 8.3 9 8.3 9
Leopard 2K 9 9.7 9 9.7 9 9.7
Leopard 2A4 9.7 10 9.7 10 9.7 10
KPz-70 9 9.3 9 9.3 9 9.3
M26 T99     6.7 6.3    
RakJPz 2 (HOT) 9 9.3 9 9.3 9 9.3
Begleitpanzer 57 8.7 8.3        
Comet I 5.3 5 5.3 5 5.3 5
Chieftain Mk 10 9 9.3 9 9.3 9 9.3
Challenger Mk.2 9.3 9.7 9.3 9.7 9.3 9.7
Chieftain Mk 3 8 8.3 8 8.3 8 8.3
Chieftain Mk 5 8.3 8.7 8.3 8.7 8.3 8.7
Iron Duke IV 5.3 5 5.3 5 5.3 5
AMX-40 9.3 9.7 9.3 9.7 9.3 9.7
Type 90 9.7 10 9.7 10 9.7 10
 

 

 

 


Feel free to leave feedback here! If you think we should make some additional changes on other machines, or do not agree with listed changes, please support your suggestions with arguments!


We read all your feedback, so it can take some time to approve your post.


Thanks!

 

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Chieftain was moved up because of powerful gun and stabilizer. I can agree that the change is not bad, but then what about T-62, that also have stabilizer, even more powerful gun (because of access to APFSDS) and the tank is more mobile?

 

With Leo A1A1 and M60A1 already at 8.3, there is no reason that T-62 should stay at 8.0, except to completely club this BR.

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Excellent changes, expand to 10.0 is the one fo the best changes in years.

Finally the Brummbar move down to 4.7 and the Super Persing obtain more acurrate 6.3.

 

I suggest give some movility for Germany in 5.7 and 6.7 moving down Panther G from 6.0 to 5.7 (is like Ersatz and this is far from OP in 5.7 agivieng to Germnay a real backup and fixing the Tiger spam) and move the Panther 2 to 6.7 again, giving the very necessary movility and support for Tiger 2.

Edited by Jagd27
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The Chieftain Mk 3's uptier I can understand but I think the Chieftain Mk 5 should stay at 8.3 with the Mk 3. It doesn't really have any significant advantages over the Mk 3 aside from the functional AA gun and a few extra horsepower, and at 8.7 the Mk 5 would be meeting Leo2k's and T64B's - something it's powerless against.

Also given the changes to the Chieftain I think the T-62 should go up to 8.3 as well.

Edit: 
Glad to see the T-62 moved up :D 

But I can't help but reiterate on the Chieftain Mk 5. Even when spaded it's not that huge of a performance gap between the Chieftain Mk 3.

 

12.13hp/t for the Chief Mk 3 when spaded, and 13.82hp/t for the Mk 5 spaded, an extra 1.69hp/t isn't really that big of a gap. No difference in armor, no difference in main armament, and only an extra 7.62mm gun on the Mk 5. It's pretty much a very slightly faster Mk 3.

Edited by Rappy33
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No change for T-62M-1 even tho it's essentially a better T-64A with slightly worse armour but significantly better gun and grind, no change to T-62 which still sits at 8.0 while all it competitors are 8.3+
No change to Object 120 which still has 9.0+ APFSDS at 7.7...

No change to Begleitpanzer which still sits at 8.7 in RB while the BMP-1P which is arguably better in some ways sits at 7.3.....

I mean, great changes for increasing the BR limit etc, but you missed some vehicles here.

I hope to see this list expanded in the near future.

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- Kikka should be raised in BR for RB and further for AB with the new engines giving it ridiculous performance that puts it on par with some 7.3/7.7 jets

 

- T-62 really needs to go up if it still has the reload buff that brings it down to 9 seconds with it's main competitors (Chieftain Mk 3, A1A1) being sent to the dirt. It has the best performance for an 8.0 apart from maybe the Object 906.

 

 

 

 

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So instead of lower BR of German 109 G10/14 you decided to raise italian G14AS to 5.3 (talking about SB) leaving italy with no starting 5.0 plane for Enduring Confrontation TierIV.  And spitfire Lf IX still sits at 5.0   Uhm i'm a bit confused. 
Oh and A7M can easily sit at 4.7 

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Why is the T-62 staying at 8.0? The Leopard A1A1 only gets APFSDS as a tier IV modification, it's a brutal grind, whereas the T-62 has stock APFSDS and better APFSDS as just a tier II modification.

Edited by rpsgc

Stona (Posted )

Take under consideration only fully spaded vehicles.
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____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Realistic Battles:


Germany

Sd.Kfz.234/2 - Battle Rating - 2.7 > 3.3

 

It is Pz.III L/M with much better mobility instead of armor.

In many situations mobility is more important then armor. Puma is a proof of it.

 

Sd.Kfz.234/4 - Battle Rating - 3.0 > 4.0

 

StuG III G with less armor but much more mobility. 

It is worst nightmare for French tanks.

Great cannon, one of the best vehicles in german tree and it can drive backwards as fast as forward.

 

StuG III G - ERA - II > III

 

Because StuG isn't counted in many tasks in events.
____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Realistic Battles:

 

Great Britain

Whirlwind Mk.I - Battle Rating - 4.3 > 3.3

 

Look at other Heavy Fighters. 
USA: P-38E (3.0) and P-38G (3.7).

USSR: I-29 (2.7) and Yak-4 (2.3).

Germany: Do 217 J-1/2 (2.7), Do 217 N-1/2 (3.3).

Japan: Ki 45 All Versions (2.3-2.7).

 

Whirlwind is similiar in speed, turn time, even in firepower.

What this plane offers, doesn't differ from Spitfire Mk.IIb. 

As a larger construction it is equipped with 4 cannons Hispano Mk.I instead 2, but it is worse in turning and climbing. Max speed is very similiar.

One of the most rare airplanes in battles.

____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

 

Realistic Battles:

 

Germany/Italy

BF 109 G14 - Battle Rating - 5.3 > 5.0
BF 109 G14/AS - Battle Rating - 5.3 > 5.0

BF 109 G10 - Battle Rating - 5.3 > 5.0

 

These planes are detachment in terms of the capabilities of its greatest enemy - P-51D-30, having a higher battle classification. It would perfectly fit in 5.0 right after G-6 (4.7) and before K-4 (5.3). 

They would be good counterpart for P-47D-28, P-47N-15, P-38L-5-LO and P-51D-30.

____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

 

Realistic Battles:

 

Germany

 

Panther D - Battle Rating - 5.7 > 5.3

 

With its turret's rotation urban battles are a torment. M18 Hellcat, A34 Comet and T-34-85(D-5T) are worthy opponents with whom Panther D should face.


Panther A - Battle Rating - 6.0 > 5.7
Panther G - Battle Rating - 6.0 > 5.7

 

These tanks aren't better then Tiger I H1 and E which are on BR 5.7. They are almost equal to T-34-85 and much worse then Centurion Mk.1 on the same Battle Rating.

____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Realistic Battles:

 

Great Britain

 

A34 Comet I & Iron Duke IV - Battle Rating - Doesn't need change

 

Mobility and grat firepower make this tank a great opponent for Panthers and T-34-85's. 

Edited by Tivoru
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T-62 > 8.3, its comparable to chieftains in general  and should be with them at the same br, furthermore, apfsds is working very well atm and t62 if it remains at 8.0 will club everything. 

P51h > 6.7, if ki84 is 6.3, superprop mustang has to be higher in br because it is better in everything compared to ki84 and especially j2m3 and a7m that it will now face if it remains 6.3

 

Edited by AlphaSRB
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Some good changes here but could the Chieftain Mk 5 possibly get access to improved rounds such as L15A4 or L15A5 since it seems destined to forever sit 0.3 above the Chieftain Mk 3 despite the only advantage being a small boost in engine power?

 

I also agree with Godman82 that with the T-62 should also move up in BR since it has a more potent (also stabilised) gun, and superior mobility making it an adequate counter to the slow and regular APDS-equipped Chieftain Mk 3.

 

While we're decompressing (RB):

 

The Conqueror with it's new armour upgrade could perhaps go to 7.7 with the threat of the Leopard A1A1 spam gone with the BR increase to 9.0. It'd be good if APDS damage were buffed and the problem of crewmembers absorbing HESH spalling were fixed too though.

 

The Centurion Mk 10 might also be able to go to 7.7 if given L52 APDS (same performance as M728 IIRC) to make up for the lack of mobility and/or armour compared to other 7.7s.

 

The Vickers MBT could go to 7.3 but no higher since it's only advantages over the Centurion Mk 10 are a slightly higher average speed and a faster reload which don't really seem to make up for the 60-80mm of armour it has and a lackluster acceleration.

 

A couple of other suggestions (Still RB):

 

I don't suppose there is any chance we could put the Tortoise on that list too, for a BR of 6.3? Especially since the nerf to the 32 Pounder's performance at 60°.

 

The Crusader AA Mk I doesn't belong at 4.7 with it's slow RoF, worse killing power (despite the larger calibre) and much slower traverse than the Crusader AA Mk II. Perhaps it could be placed at a lower BR such as 4.0?

 

The Black Prince doesn't belong at 6.0 anymore with the way APDS performs now. It could rely on it's APCBC round but often weakspots must be targeted when using this round (unlike other heavy tanks with HV guns). Given the poor mobility of this tank it should be able to rely on it's armour but now has to deal with French guns that can reliably penetrate that armour as well as the original German guns. I'd suggest 5.7 for this tank.

Edited by Time4Tea
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Moving the LeoA1A1 up to 9.0? Really? That makes the stock grind even worse than it is now... Just because of APFSDS later?  Come on its now Matched with 10.0 tanks. For real now?

Edited by TimTimONE
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I am a little confused that the XM-1 is considered on-par with the Leopard 1A1A1. The A1A1 is very good but the XM-1 is better in every way. Also if the Challenger must be a 9.7 can you consider reorganizing the module grind to either remove stock APDS or making the L23 a Tier I module? The Leopard 2K gets its only dart at Tier I (a better dart than the L23) but the Challenger has to wait for tier II and then tier IV for the L23A1.

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Nice to see BR expansion until 10.0, but that will probably not be enough, much more decompression is needed in both air and ground vehicles.

Some individual BR changes:

LeoA1A1 is much needed change, but it also needs to be given competetive ammo stock. As for me, I haven't yet unlocked even HEAT ammo, no talking about APFSDS. Having 7.0 ammo at 9.0 is really not that enjoyable gaming experience. 

Bagelpanzer57- it could easily go down to 8.0 in RB, yet no change there is made. 

On a similar note, BMP1 should move up to higher BR as well.

Chieftain mk5 should be same BR as mk3

T62- No reason for it not to be 8.7 now, since leo1a1 and m60rise is up

Comet- I really doubt it needs change, its a fair competitor to T3485 and can be 5.3 easily

Obj120- there is really no more reason for it to be 7.7. With this slight wave of decompression, it could easily fit BR 8.3-8.7

Edited by palmatius100
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Seems like copy/pasting this list is part of the usual routine with every BR change cycle, so here goes nothing:

 

However, there are some notable changes that should be implemented for Air RB:

  • La-11 [USSR] 5.3 -> 5.0: This aircraft is worse than the La-7 in every single way, and is truly terrible at its BR of 5.3. With a worse time to climb (TTC), speed, and maneuverability, this plane struggles at 5.3 MM, where it frequently faces off against 5.7-6.3 Allied aircraft. Put at a proposed BR of 5.0, this plane would no longer frequently meet 5.7-6.0 aircraft as the norm, and get even matchmaking at 5.0 more often. The only benefit the La-11 has over the La-7 is armament, although that can be debatable for many.
  • Seafire FR.47 [UK] 6.0-> 5.7: This plane is definitely not 6.0 material. While the 150 Octane mod brought about an improvement for the FR.47's performance, in practical terms, it is still very slow and sluggish. Despite having a similar TTC as the Spitfire Mk.22, the FR.47 is disadvantaged in straight-line speed, maneuverability, and longevity in battle. This latter aspect is due to the limited ammo count which significantly reduces its effectiveness. The only issue with the FR.47's current BR is that it sees jets, and it simply cannot compete with them the way the Mk.22 can. Put at a BR of 5.7, it'd still see its current opposition often and would serve no threat to other aircraft. Practically speaking, it's a worse aircraft than the LF.9, Mk.XIVe in all variants, and the Mk.XVIIIe. For reference, the FR.47 is slower than a K-4, while also climbing worse, and being more sluggish...but the FR.47 is 6.0 while the K-4 is at 5.3.
  • F7F-1/3 [US] 6.0 -> 5.7 (both): These planes are functionally worse than the Hornet F.3 with far worse altitude performance and a much lower airspawn, yet are at 6.0 and regularly must deal with Ho 229s, Arado Cs, and MiG-9s and the Me 262. In fact, they climb worse than the Hornet F.3, and are slower at altitude - only remaining faster at altitudes below 3K meters. In many regards, the Hornet is the superior aircraft, yet while it's (rightfully) at 5.7, the F7Fs are both stuck at 6.0. If they got both their airspawn removed and started from the airfield, the F78F-1, F7F-3, and Hornet F.3 would all be rather balanced at 5.7. 
  • N1K2-J and Ja [JAPAN] 6.3 -> 5.7: After their FM revision, both of these planes have 5.7 performance at best. Their only saving grace is their climb rate (which is worse than Griffon 14s at 5.7) and 900 rounds of 20mm ammo. They aren't remotely comparable to the F8F-1B, Mk.22, P-51H, or Tempest Mk.II.
  • Bf 109G-14 [GER] 5.3 -> 5.0: Only slightly faster than the G-6 and Italian G-14/AS, and notably slower than the G-10 and K-4. Should be at an intermediate BR between the G-6 and G-10/K-4.
  • MiG-9/L [USSR] 7.0 -> 7.7: This jet is comparable to the F-84G in speed, climb rate, maneuverability, and capability. As such, it should not be 7.0 considering it blows all of them out of the water in every regard.
  • G.91 R/1 [ITALY] 8.0 -> 9.0: This jet is as capable (if not more capable) as a F-86A-5 Sabre. Why is it a full 1.0 BR lower?
  • P-51H-5-NA (US) 6.3 -> 6.7: Should be obvious, it's the best prop in the game and has no business fighting 5.3 props of any nation. It was moved down largely due to being clubbed by Italian F-84Gs on its introduction, but that does not warrant clubbing 5.3 props every other match. It is simply impossible for wartime 5.3 props to win against competent P-51H pilots who will out-climb, out-accelerate, out-run, out-energy fight, and often times out-gun their opposition. Of course, 5.7 props struggle too, but baby steps...

  • Meteor Mk.8 [UK] 8.0 -> 9.0: This plane's acceleration, energy retention, and climb rate are far too good for proper 7.0 jets to contend with, much like the G.91. It needs to be moved back to 9.0 where it used to belong.

  • F-82E (US) 5.0 -> 5.7: Combination of airspawn, speed, roll rate, armament  leave this plane in a ludicrously undertiered spot. Probably the most egregious undertiering of any prop in the game. It can wreak havoc with near impunity. Why is the BR from the old days when it had a broken FM still reflective of its current performance?!

  • Kikka [japan] 6.7 -> 7.3: With the new engines introduced in 1.79, the Kikka is now a superior plane to the 262 A-1a, and it deserves to be tiered as such. The acceleration, speed, and RoC make its current 6.7 BR incredibly outdated. 

 

  • Fw 190 D-9/12/13 [GER] 5.3 -> 5.7: With the current improvements to their FMs making them far superior to 4.3-4.7 opposition, the current 5.3 BR (where they get incessantly downtiered into 4.3-7 games) is absolutely ridiculous. The BR change was a symptom of P-47 airspawns in past patch metas. Since this is no longer the case, this should be rectified immediately.
  • MB.5 [UK] 5.3 -> 5.7: One only need to look at the insane speed of this plane to realize how ludicrous a 5.3 BR is for it...

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Aquilachrysaetos
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There are two J2M3s on this list, i think the latter of them is supposed to be the J2M4 Kai, since it is the only one with a BR of 5.0 in RB.

Stona (Posted )

Fixed, thanks!
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Spitfire Mk Vc (SB EC) BR 5.0 -> 4.7

At this moment is almost the most unplayable British fighter in SB EC, it's forced to fight against much better airplanes like the BF-109K-4 or Fw-190D which are 60-80 km/h faster, also it has some overheating issues, for the most of time you are forced to fly with the throttle set to 80%. Good armament and turn rate doesn't really help if you can't even get close to anyone and you are constatly BnZ'ed by German fighters.

Currently no one plays this airplane, because it's really hard to fly the Spitfires in SB (probably the most difficult airplane to fly in SB) after last big FM update and high Battle Rating doesn't really help at all. All you can do is hope that you will meet someone flying at really low speed (400-500 km/h) at low altitude and then hope that this player will start dogfighting with you (that will most likely not happen because everyone know that the Spitfire is good at turnfighting). Airplane is also very unstable compared to German airplanes, it's really hard to hit something.

 

Small comparison:

Spitfire Mk Vc (BR 5.0)

Max speed at 1k alt - 100% - 496 km/h (you can use 100% of power for only 5-10 minutes) / WEP - 547 km/h (you can use WEP for only 1-3 minutes)

Max speed at 3k alt - 100% - 539 km/h (you can use 100% of power for only 5-10 minutes) / WEP - 592 km/h (you can use WEP for only 1-3 minutes)

Sustained turn rate at 2k alt - 15-13s

Climb rate at 2k alt - 18-19 m/s

 

BF-109G-6 (BR 4.7)

Max speed at 1k alt - 100% - 526 km/h (you can use 100% of power for 20-40 minutes) / WEP - 588 km/h (you can use WEP for 5-10 minutes)

Max speed at 3k alt - 100% - 544 km/h (you can use 100% of power for 20-40 minutes) / WEP - 609 km/h (you can use WEP for 5-10 minutes)

Sustained turn rate at 2k alt - 22-19s

Climb rate at 2k alt - 23-22 m/s

 

BF-109G-10 (BR 5.3)

Max speed at 1k alt - 100% - 564 km/h (you can use 100% of power for 20-40 minutes) / WEP - 603 km/h (you can use WEP for 5-10 minutes)

Max speed at 3k alt - 100% - 592 km/h (you can use 100% of power for 20-40 minutes) / WEP - 634 km/h (you can use WEP for 5-10 minutes)

Sustained turn rate at 2k alt - 21-19s

Climb rate at 2k alt - 24-22 m/s

 

Fw-190A-5/U12 (BR 4.7)

Max speed at 1k alt - 100% - 572 km/h (there's really no limit, you can use it forever as long as you set your radiator to 20-30%) / WEP - 601 km/h (you can use WEP for 10-20 minutes)

Max speed at 3k alt - 100% - 571 km/h (there's really no limit, you can use it forever as long as you set your radiator to 20-30%) / WEP - 600 km/h (you can use WEP for 10-20 minutes)

Sustained turn rate at 2k alt - 23-21s

Climb rate at 2k alt - 18-16 m/s

 

Fw-190A-8 (5.0)

Max speed at 1k alt - 100% - 550 km/h (there's really no limit, you can use it forever as long as you set your radiator to 20-30%) / WEP - 581 km/h (you can use WEP for 10-20 minutes)

Max speed at 3k alt - 100% - 547 km/h (there's really no limit, you can use it forever as long as you set your radiator to 20-30%) / WEP - 595 km/h (you can use WEP for 10-20 minutes)

Sustained turn rate at 2k alt - 25-23s

Climb rate at 2k alt - 17-15 m/s

 

Fw-190D-9 (5.3)

Max speed at 1k alt - 100% - 589 km/h (you can use 100% of power for 10-20 minutes) / WEP - 631 km/h (you can use WEP for 3-5 minutes)

Max speed at 3k alt - 100% - 625 km/h (you can use 100% of power for 10-20 minutes) / WEP - 657 km/h (you can use WEP for 3-5 minutes)

Sustained turn rate at 2k alt - 24-22s

Climb rate at 2k alt - 22-21 m/s

 

Btw, SB EC is mostly about flying at 1000 - 4000m ALT and keeping as high speed at it's possible in a straight line, that's why I posted informations about speed, turn rate and climb rate at only 1-3k alt.

 

Edit

 

Whirlwind Mk.1  4.7 (SB EC III) ---> 3.3 (SB EC II)

Currently it's one of the worst fighters in SB EC III, I haven't seen it even once because of it's poor performance compared to other airplanes, people don't want to play it because BR 4.7 is just too high, even some heavy fighters like the Me 410 have much better performance and armament and every fighter like the BF-109 or Fw-190 can outturn and outrun it.

Whirlwind would be much better at 3.3 (to make it available in SB EC II) and it wouldn't be overpowered compared to axis fighters. BF-109F-1/2, Fw-190A-1 and MC 202 are faster than the Whirlwind and have only slightly worse armament, it would be comparable to heavy fighters like the BF-110C, I-29 or Yak-2 KABB.

 

Edited by RideR2
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10 minutes ago, Tivoru said:

Sd.Kfz.234/2 - Battle Rating - 2.7 > 3.3

 

It is Pz.III L/M with much better mobility instead of armor.

If this armoured car would be placed into 2nd ERA, it would receive Scout Ability

 

The Puma is already at ERA / Rank 2

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The T-62 really needs moved up now, unless major changes to how it performs and how its represented in the game are coming to bring it more in line with its real weaknesses.

 

Comet is a welcome change, but I'd rather see its APDS fixed to have proper post-pen than a BR reduction.

 

KV-1B still hasn't been properly increased, while the Tortoise still hasn't been decreased. Two of the most obvious changes needed to happen for years now. Especially since the Tortoise took a heavy nerf lately.

Edited by TheFuzzieOne
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Chieftains shouldn't be up-tiered.

 

This seems to continue the nonsense of the Chief. 5 being ranked higher than the Mk. 3, even though they are nigh identical, there are more significant differences to be found with the Panther A and Panther F, yet both of those share the same battle rating of 6.0.

Both should be placed at 8.0, especially considering that the T-62, AMX-30 other such legacy tanks appear to be remaining at their current battle ratings.

 

Leopard 1 A1A1 and M60A1 RISE shouldn't be up-tiered.

 

Leopard 1A1A1 and M60A1 RISE both do not deserve to fight the top-most tanks like the Type 90 and M1 Abrams, 8.7 is a fine battle rating for their capabilities, again, considering that similar vehicles like the T-55A, T-62M-1 and Type 74 aren't being up-tiered, neither should they.

Additionally, both of these vehicle stock are only equipped with APDS, this round is massively under-powered against what they will then face on a regular basis.

 

Panther II back to 6.7.

 

The introduction of the IS-6 gave the Panther II quite significant troubles, especially in that shortly after it's up-tiering to 7.0, it also received a mobility decrease due to the increased weight, this took away the major advantage it previously held.

Considering it is essentially reduced to a slightly more mobile Tiger II with drastically less protection, I don't see why it can;t be returned to 6.7 once more.

 

Down-tier the Panther F, A and Panther G to 5.7

 

These Panther's are largely made pointless by simply comparing them to the T-V and Ersatz, both of these are essentially Panther A's and Panther G's, but placed at a lower battle ratings already.

Additionally, a lot of other changes have taken place that have reduced the effectiveness of these machines over the years, the new armour overmatch mechanic, introduction of more powerful machines within their BR range (T29, T34, etc) and the down-tiering of similar vehicles around it.

 

 

 

Edited by Necrons31467
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French jets needs a serious rebalance in BR, this is completely ridiculous when you compare the planes with other nations at the same BR

 

-M.D.450B ouragan/barougan  ---->   7.3    AB/RB/SB

 

-M.D.452 Mystère IIA               ---->    8.0   AB/RB/SB   

 

-M.D.452 Mystere IIC               ---->   8.0   AB/RB/SB      

 

EDIT :

 

As  of why a downtier is needed for these planes

 

-M.D.450B :  In term of performance the plane is roughly equal to the attacker FB 1 and the F3D, yet it is sitting 1 point of BR higher considered equal to the G91 and yak 30 wich on paper and in flight doesn't, and get  clubbed hard at his own BR,  at 8.0 this plane can face 9.0 and I don't even want to talk about that. The plane is enjoyable to fly only when it's downtiered facing equal opponents, 7.3 would be the nice spot for this plane.

 

-M.D.452 Mystère IIA/C : The same problem as the M.D.450B but worse, at 9.0 this is just food for CL and MIGs there is absolutely nothing you can do, they out climb/speed/accelerate/turn.

Same story as the M.D.450B, planes with similar performance than the mystère II are 1 BR lower than it, considering the french jet fighters performs very poorly since their introduction some love for them would be nice.

Edited by HK_supralK
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