Fwd:2018-05-17 Ki-102 Otsu Fighter/Attacker status mismatch

[Aotea 1,696]

In the Japanese aviation tree the Ki-102 Otsu is marked with the pale green squashed diamond symbol for an Attacker, but time spent flying it adds to Fighter hours.
 

The War Thunder Wiki describes it as an Attacker that can be used as a Heavy Fighter, but as this is Japan's only attacker aircraft it would be ideal if it could remain in this role, and the flight time updater changed to add hours to the Attacker role.  If this is too difficult the symbol needs to be changed to that of a fighter.

Warm regards

Aotea

[ganJ 2,692]

Hello @Aotea

 

Thank you for the report.

I will read through what you've posted, investigate, test and get back to you.

[ganJ 2,692]

Hello!
 

Thank you for your help improving the game, your information has been forwarded to the developers.  
 

This thread will remain unlocked for a period of time so that anyone with additional information\evidence\examples will have a place to post.  It will also serve as a place where the developers may post questions for you to answer so please keep up to date here. Please note, only posts relevant to the topic will be approved, all others will remain hidden.

 

[[email protected] 1,411]

Hi, Pilot and Tech mod,

I would like to add information\evidence\examples.

 

In historical facts, Ki-102 Otsu is designed as ground-attack aircraft.
However, due to the incorrect report investigated by the Allies, there is a misunderstanding that Ki-102 Otsu is an interceptor.

Ki-102 Otsu was added to the game as a fighter in Update 1.35, and the aircraft type was changed to Attacker in Update 1.65, but the confusion treated as a fighter continues.

Ki-102 Otsu needs to be handled as an Attacker in the game.

 

Source

Book:

Spoiler

 

 

Point out to PB Report

• Ki-102:  It is a fictitious Ki-102 Interceptor that misunderstood the Ki-102 Otsu Assault-plane.
• Ki-102A: Although it is Ki-102 Ko, there is no explanation that it is equipped with exhaust turbosupercharger and that it is High Altitude Fighter.
• Ki-102B: Ki-102 Otsu, explained as a twin-engine Attacker and there is no problem with data.
• Ki-102C: It is presumed to be KI-102 Hei, but it does not explain that it is Night fighter.
• KI-102(MOD): Inaccurate. Data of another aircraft is mixed.

Quote

It is inferred that Ki-102 used for air defense battle was misunderstood that it is different from the Assault-plane version.

防空戦闘に使用されたキ102は、襲撃機型と別のものと誤解されたのであろう。

 

There were some mistakes in the data table of the PB Report, and from the time it was announced, it was controversial among Japanese aircraft researchers about how far we could trust.

PBレポートのデータ表は、このほかにもいくつかの間違いがあり、公表されたころから、日本機研究者の間では、どこまで信用してよいかという点が論議の的になっていた。

 

Mechanism of Military Aircraft; "Toryu" / Type 99 Assault/Tactical Reconnaissance. Edit by Magazine Maru Editorial Department, Published by Ushioshobokojinshinsha Co., Ltd. November 1999. ISBN-13: 978-4769809159. pp.150-151.

 

I guess that the PB Report mentioned in the book is about PB Historical Collection.

Quote

PB Historical Collection

The TRS collection of 150,000 Publication Board (PB) hardcopy and microfilm reports dating from 1945 to 1964 documents the history of technology during the immediate post-war period. Many of the early reports were published only after they were declassified, and even then they had a limited distribution. Reports released prior to 1948 were typically captured materials from Germany and Japan that had been obtained by Allied research teams (please also consult the "German Captured Documents Collection" Finding Aid for materials held in the Manuscripts Division of the Library). 

https://www.loc.gov/rr/scitech/trs/trspb.html

 

 

Reference

Assault-plane is "Shūgeki-ki" (襲撃機) in Japanese and "Sturmovik" (Штурмовик) in Russian.

The fact that Ki-102 Otsu Assault-plane is treated as a fighter and there is neither a bomb nor AP shell is the same as IL-2 Sturmovik is treated as a fighter and there is neither a bomb nor AP shell.
However, for some reason the developer felt hesitant to fix the problem.
I guess this is because it has sources that misunderstand Ki-102 Otsu as an interceptor and is confusing developers.

Quote

Q.

Tell me whether the game will be Japanese Ki 102 (option a and c)? 

And why did not the airplane of variant b be given suspensions + why there are no Armor piercers for the 57 mm cannon?

Подскажите будут ли в игре японские самолёты Ki 102 (варианта а и с)? 

И почему самолёту варианта b не дали подвесы + почему нет Бронебойных снарядов для 57 мм пушки?

 

A.

The work is on. More can not say.

Работа идет. Большего не могу сказать.

(Developer WarThunder V_S_N)

https://forum.warthunder.ru/index.php?/topic/107569-v_s_nнная-строгая-модерация/&do=findComment&comment=6185904

 

Quote

Q.

In the new update 1.65 "The Way of the Samurai" justice finally triumphed - the Japanese airplane Ki-102 otsu became, as it was in reality, a stormtrooper. However, he did not have pylons for pendant bombs and armor-piercing shells. Why? In the specially created player  amax the theme is given photos and pylons and armor-piercing projectile:

В новом обновлении 1.65 «Путь самурая» наконец восторжествовала справедливость - японский самолёт Ки-102 оtsu стал, как и было в реальности, штурмовиком. Однако у него не появились пилоны для подвески бомб и бронебойные снаряды. Почему? В специально созданной игроком amax теме приведены фото и пилонов и бронебойного снаряда:

Dear V_S_N, please help the installation of bombs on the airplane with assault recharging and armor-piercing shells. Without it, calling Ki-102 Sturmovik, to put it mildly, is ridiculous - he simply has nothing to storm heavy equipment.
Уважаемый V_S_N, посодействуйте пожалуйста установке на самолёте бомб со штурмовой перезарядкой и бронебойных снарядов. Без этого называть Ки-102 Штурмовиком, мягко говоря, нелепо - штурмовать тяжёлую технику ему просто нечем.

 

A.

Let us discuss this question. But I can not promise a quick decision.

Обсудим этот вопрос. Но быстрого решения не могу обещать.

(Developer WarThunder V_S_N)

https://forum.warthunder.ru/index.php?/topic/107569-v_s_nнная-строгая-модерация/&do=findComment&comment=6024926

 

 

I submitted a bug report explaining that Ki-102 Otsu is an Attacker and not a Fighter.

 

I am convinced that the information that Ki-102 Otsu is an Attacker has arrived at the developer.

Quote

History

 

Development of the Ki-108 began in April 1943 after Kawasaki wanted to fulfil a standing

requirement with the Japanese Army for a heavy interceptor that initially began with the Ki-45 heavy fighter series. The Ki-108’s design was derived mostly from the previous Ki-102 project and took some elements of the Ki-96 as well, effectively combining the two designs into one. After the first B-29 Superfortress bombers made their appearance over the Japanese home islands, the need for such a high-altitude interceptor became even more emphasized. Two Ki-102 otsu airframes were taken from the assembly line in 1944 to produce the initial Ki-108 prototypes. Compared to the Ki-102, which was intended as a low-altitude attack aircraft, the Ki-108 was an interceptor meant for high altitude operations. To allow for this, the Ki-108’s cockpit had to be significantly reduced in size and was to be hermetically sealed. This effectively turned the Ki-108 into a single-seater, reduced weight and decreased the strain on the engines all at the same time, which allowed for better performance at higher altitudes.

https://forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/401246-development-kawasaki-ki-108-the-final-dragon-slayer/

Edited May 21, 2018 by *tester188

[ganJ 2,692]

@*tester188

Thank you for additional info