DarkHearth

Conqueror - What is your opinion?

The three biggest issues holding this big boy back, is the cupola, ammo, and gun shield. If they up the ammo damage, give it the t95 cupola buff, and fix the crappy mantle plate its would be a good vehicle. I got seven kills and gained survivor with this baby. It's just that I had to get the first shot every time or I would probably be toast. Center mass shots too, or I just get assists. Reload I could handle if those other issues were fixed, its just the damage disparity is not worth the extra penetration granted by a big APDS vs a AP shot.

  • Upvote 4
medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

An improved mantlet (still among those waiting to see the documentation for the present values in the hopes of bug reporting that...) and better post pen effects would make this a real monster. Especially the mantlet fix has the potential to see this as an easy 7.7 or even 8.0. Even as it sits now it’s definitely a potent killer, and one of the few reliable counters to the likes of the IS-7 that’s below that one’s BR. 

medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, CRGKevin said:

An improved mantlet (still among those waiting to see the documentation for the present values in the hopes of bug reporting that...) and better post pen effects would make this a real monster. Especially the mantlet fix has the potential to see this as an easy 7.7 or even 8.0. Even as it sits now it’s definitely a potent killer, and one of the few reliable counters to the likes of the IS-7 that’s below that one’s BR. 

Well it came out as 7.7 and was quite good when APDS worked. Even when the armor was full of holes and the whole floor is missing (could be killed by LMG or nearby arty).

 

The Conqueror in real life is a close match to the M103, which shared the same basic gun design but fired mostly CE instead of KE.

  • Upvote 1
medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I love this tank, I truly do. I can have great games in it, but you need to play hull-down and be very careful. Turret is amazing if not for that mantlet, I mean it can still stop T-10M APHE and even APDS, but sometimes it can be penned by a long 88 from a mile away so yeah. After recent buff to APDS it can one-shot T-54 almost always, but still struggles with tanks where residual penetration is small or when crew is spread out nicely.

Spading this tank and having good crew is a whole new level. Rangefinder, faster reload and mods to mobility helps a lot.

 

Ps. As for the mantlet, Scraper did not answer my question and Smin have no clue about the change in the model, so I think we should just try to get some documentation from Bovington maybe. Oh and it would be cool to have the penetration of sabot fixed as well. I know that slope pen would be reduced, but you cant pen things like T-10M UFP anyway and higher flat pen would increase damage due to residual pen thingy.

  • Thanks 1
  • Upvote 2
medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, FilipAleksanderS said:

I love this tank, I truly do. I can have great games in it, but you need to play hull-down and be very careful. Turret is amazing if not for that mantlet, I mean it can still stop T-10M APHE and even APDS, but sometimes it can be penned by a long 88 from a mile away so yeah. After recent buff to APDS it can one-shot T-54 almost always, but still struggles with tanks where residual penetration is small or when crew is spread out nicely.

Spading this tank and having good crew is a whole new level. Rangefinder, faster reload and mods to mobility helps a lot.

 

Ps. As for the mantlet, Scraper did not answer my question and Smin have no clue about the change in the model, so I think we should just try to get some documentation from Bovington maybe. Oh and it would be cool to have the penetration of sabot fixed as well. I know that slope pen would be reduced, but you cant pen things like T-10M UFP anyway and higher flat pen would increase damage due to residual pen thingy.

 

They have documentation from Bovington already they used it the last time they buffed the turret

medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

All the more reason to use it to fix the mantlet problem. If they consider it an acceptable source then they couldn’t reject a report using the same one. Or if they do, they’d be saying the well respected Bovington, which is not only a first class primary source in general but also has an example of a Conqueror MK1 in their collection, would be wrong. 

Edited by CRGKevin
Correcting something in my post. Bovington has the MK1, not MK2.
medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

after playing for awhile it just feels sub par compared to the m103 i got HE shells ignoring the add on armor i got HEATFS ignoring add on armor on the turret and i got atgms that ignore the add on armor on the turret the APDS shell is so horid it actually need a post pen and fragmentation buff seriously hits the rear of a is7 and all it kills is a loader and commander or i hit the back of a amx 30 and it only knocks out the commander or worse i fight an is6 and get its side i knock out a commander or loader but no crew knock out i do hit ammo but it turns black and does not detonate which it should if the APDS shell got a buff in the fragmentation and damaging more than 1 or if your luck 2 crew members then it would be worth playing but right now all im doing is spading it then removing it from my line up and if you think it can pen is7 from the front it does not do so in regular pub matches i have tried dozens of times and nothing only a knocked out cannon barrel better yet it struggles with any russian heavy tank at 7.3 and higher except is6 if you shoot is6 from the front

Edited by Kibo_o_Hopu
  • Upvote 1
medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 28/03/2018 at 05:28, DarkHearth said:

What is your opinion?

 

I have the possibility to get the Conqueror in a relatively short time. I have read in the forum everything that is said about the tank and in general, the comments are not very good. Has anything changed in the Conqueror with the recent updates? As an alternative it seems that the M103 is still a better tank in every way.

 

If someone has the tank, I will be very grateful that he will tell me about his experience with him and if he personally recommends his acquisition. Thanks.

when i see a Conqueror in any of my T5 or T6 tanks, i choose to go around it if i can.

its a **** to head on even with APFSDS.

 

 

A good Conqueror players sits hul down because of its rofl APDS with sick penetration values and its rofl armour that almost no tank can compete against.

and to hide its only weakspot, the LFP. you can shoot its gunmantlet but you will mostly only take out its gun.

  • Haha 1
  • Confused 3
medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Turra said:

when i see a Conqueror in any of my T5 or T6 tanks, i choose to go around it if i can.

its a **** to head on even with APFSDS.

 

 

A good Conqueror players sits hul down because of its rofl APDS with sick penetration values and its rofl armour that almost no tank can compete against.

and to hide its only weakspot, the LFP. you can shoot its gunmantlet but you will mostly only take out its gun.

Since I’ve been putting together a German 6.7 lineup centered on the Tiger II, I’ll occasionally encounter the Conqueror. I’ll usually try to make a shot at the weakspots, but usually all that happens is I bounce off the turret and then get killed. If I do manage to somehow survive, I try to get somewhere else fast since I’m completely outmatched by it. Especially since I always face the good players who hide their LFP and I never live long enough to zero in on the mantlet or cupola... 

 

Then afterwards I’ll quite often go grab my UK 7.3 lineup and drive out my own Conqueror! 

  • Upvote 1
medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, Kibo_o_Hopu said:

after playing for awhile it just feels sub par compared to the m103 i got HE shells ignoring the add on armor i got HEATFS ignoring add on armor on the turret and i got atgms that ignore the add on armor on the turret

 

The armour is excellent so long as you don't allow yourself to get flanked or expose the lower hull. HE splashing downwards through the hull roof is something that every tank in the game suffers from. ATGMs aren't supposed to get magically nullified by spaced armour like in WoT, they are affected by it but most ATGMs have so much pen that it won't be enough to stop them. Conqueror is one of very few vehicles with enough turret cheek armour to stop 400mm HEAT-FS.

 

12 hours ago, Kibo_o_Hopu said:

the APDS shell is so horid it actually need a post pen and fragmentation buff seriously hits the rear of a is7 and all it kills is a loader and commander or i hit the back of a amx 30 and it only knocks out the commander or worse i fight an is6 and get its side i knock out a commander or loader but no crew knock out i do hit ammo but it turns black and does not detonate which it should if the APDS shell got a buff in the fragmentation and damaging more than 1 or if your luck 2 crew members then it would be worth playing but right now all im doing is spading it then removing it from my line up and if you think it can pen is7 from the front it does not do so in regular pub matches i have tried dozens of times and nothing only a knocked out cannon barrel better yet it struggles with any russian heavy tank at 7.3 and higher except is6 if you shoot is6 from the front

 

The APDS is unforgiving but fortunately the stabiliser (which many enemies don't have) and tough armour give you the opportunity to take a few extra moments to get your shot placement right. For example, shooting at the rear of an IS-7 I would always go for the back of the turret - there is ammo there which if hit guarantees the kill but even if not you can take out many or even all the turret crew and <crucially> the cannon breech to stop him returning fire while you reload. From the front aim for the cheeks as near to the gun as possible but not the gun mantle itself.

  • Upvote 1
medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, CRGKevin said:

Since I’ve been putting together a German 6.7 lineup centered on the Tiger II, I’ll occasionally encounter the Conqueror. I’ll usually try to make a shot at the weakspots, but usually all that happens is I bounce off the turret and then get killed. If I do manage to somehow survive, I try to get somewhere else fast since I’m completely outmatched by it. Especially since I always face the good players who hide their LFP and I never live long enough to zero in on the mantlet or cupola... 

 

Then afterwards I’ll quite often go grab my UK 7.3 lineup and drive out my own Conqueror! 

I want the Conqueror.... i'm grinding britts now, but still at 3.3br

  • Haha 1
medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 hours ago, Kibo_o_Hopu said:

APDS shell is so horid it actually need a post pen and fragmentation buff seriously

I reguarly use the apds shells in the SU-122-54 and the apds on the t10m because of the ease to hit targets at long range.

i don't have much of a problem nowadays to damage tanks with it, idk maybe it is a difference between apds and apds cross countries but i don't think so.

 

If you think of apds like needles (as they are) you will not have much of a problem using them, i reguarly cook of ammo with direct hits and never have problems with module damage on hit.

 

plus i don't have the luxury of 10s reloads.  so when i fire apds i always aim for the gunbreach first, if not the ammo if i shoose to do so.

but you know, often when i hit modules to neutralize targets they more than often have good enough repair speed to repair faster than my gun can reload...wich is bs on a totaly new level...

 

apds should however do more shrapnel than it currently does, but not much more, apds is not nearly as effective damagewise as solid AP rounds.

  • Confused 1
medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Turra said:

I reguarly use the apds shells in the SU-122-54 and the apds on the t10m because of the ease to hit targets at long range.

 

afaik these tanks have better zoom than the Conqueror 

3 hours ago, Turra said:

If you think of apds like needles (as they are)

 

iirc Shot L1G uses a 75mm penetrator

3 hours ago, Turra said:

 

plus i don't have the luxury of 10s reloads. 

 

 

Top reload for the Conq is 14.9 seconds

 

Conqueror: 19.4 seconds base (no crew training)

SU-122-54: 16.0 seconds base

T-10M;        20 seconds base

 

Truly the Conqueror lives a life of luxury

 

  • Confused 1
  • Upvote 3
medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, *RAazzy91 said:

Top reload for the Conq is 14.9 seconds

 

Conqueror: 19.4 seconds base (no crew training)

SU-122-54: 16.0 seconds base

T-10M;        20 seconds base

 

Truly the Conqueror lives a life of luxury

10s reloads was more directed against the other brittish tanks that use apds.

 

the conquerer has slow reload yup. thats true.

11 minutes ago, *RAazzy91 said:

afaik these tanks have better zoom than the Conqueror

sure, but worse pen for the SU-122-54, even tho its in the same br and has a 122mm cannon. and its a TD, its supposed to hide far back and snipe.

 

and T10m has about the same apds preformence (in stats anyways) as the conquerer, but its a 1.0 br difference between them.

and this tank is a 1.0 br higher than the conq, it would be wierd if it does not have a better zoom.

11 minutes ago, *RAazzy91 said:

Truly the Conqueror lives a life of luxury

and yes, i would say so, its not the worst reload, and it has the best armour in its br by far, weak sides aren't rly a big offset, any tank hit in the side would be killed and/or severely damaged.

 

Edited by Turra
medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, *RAazzy91 said:

iirc Shot L1G uses a 75mm penetrator

i would not say its damage output is worse than a solid ap round in that caliber.

medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, Turra said:

and it has the best armour in its br by far, weak sides aren't rly a big offset, any tank hit in the side would be killed and/or severely damaged.

I get critted or one-shot through the mantlet/cupola/gunner optics by APHE too many times to agree with that and I would say that the weak sides are a big offset when the angle of engagement needed to penetrate a Conqueror's side is much wider than it is for other heavies.

11 minutes ago, Turra said:

i would not say its damage output is worse than a solid ap round in that caliber.

It is when hitting thinner armour at least - makes killing hull-down leopards tricky sometimes.

  • Upvote 5
medal medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, Time4Tea said:

I get critted or one-shot through the mantlet/cupola/gunner optics by APHE too many times

i have yet to kill a conquerer from the gunmantlet, i only seem to damage the gunbreach no matter what i shot through that darn thing.

(100mm APHE from T54's, 122mm APHE from IS-6/3/2)

 

and if you miss the gunmantlet, you will bounce 100% :D (i've done it too many times to count in my T-62)

10 minutes ago, Time4Tea said:

It is when hitting thinner armour at least - makes killing hull-down leopards tricky sometimes.

Those pesky leopards can sometimes troll you big time! i have had apfsds from the T-62 absorbed by the leo turret sometimes??

and yeah i know that apds need a a minium amount of armour to reach its damage potential.

 

still, it has rofl hesh to deal with lightly armoured tanks.

medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, Time4Tea said:

It is when hitting thinner armour at least - makes killing hull-down leopards tricky sometimes.

Talking about solid AP...

Sometime it just can't do what APHE does.

 

I was at a match in my M103. Used up all HEAT so I was firing AP. Enemy spawned a ZSU-57 about 900m away and was hull-down. My first shot wiped out his turret but didn't hull break it.

I continued to fire every 17 seconds with AP. I fired a total of 6 rounds, wiped out his turret twice and he still lived to shoot up my track twice. I was eventually flanked by a BMP1 and died.

 

If I fired APHE, even a 90mm M82, that thing would has been dead from the very first hit.

Edited by Loongsheep
  • Upvote 2
medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Loongsheep said:

Talking about solid AP...

Sometime it just can't do what APHE does.

 

I was at a match in my M103. Used up all HEAT so I was firing AP. Enemy spawned a ZSU-57 about 900m away and was hull-down. My first shot wiped out his turret but didn't hull break it.

I continued to fire every 17 seconds with AP. I fired a total of 6 rounds, wiped out his turret twice and he still lived to shoot up my track twice. I was eventually flanked by a BMP1 and died.

 

If I fired APHE, even a 90mm M82, that thing has died from the very first hit.

Sounds like a horrible experience, the ZSU-57-2 should have gone hullbroken...

 

but even APHE would strugle with what you did, APHE has a fuze activation of minimum 15mm on soviet tanks and more often 20+mm on other tanks (like german tanks), so if youre hitting the ZSU you would not activate the fuze and it would do about the same as what solid ap does.

medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Turra said:

Sounds like a horrible experience, the ZSU-57-2 should have gone hullbroken...

 

but even APHE would strugle with what you did, APHE has a fuze activation of minimum 15mm on soviet tanks and more often 20+mm on other tanks (like german tanks), so if youre hitting the ZSU you would not activate the fuze and it would do about the same as what solid ap does.

Hitting the gun breech would trigger the fuze if it was an APHE.

  • Upvote 1
medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 19/11/2018 at 21:42, Ghost_Rider12 said:

 

They have documentation from Bovington already they used it the last time they buffed the turret

Okey so hear me out. Few months ago I was discussing this mantlet issue with Smin and you know what? All documents that Gaijin got from Bovington about Conqueror are included in this devblog: https://warthunder.com/en/devblog/current/870 . It means they don't even have detailed schemes of mantlet. Thats why they never listed that remodel in any changelog, they have no documentation to support current mantlet model.

 

Ps. Oh and I forgot to add, I also have asked Listy for help. Apparently he owns detailed schemes of mantlet from Bovington I guess, but he is not willing to waste time for Snail hahaha. Hmmm I wonder why?

Edited by FilipAleksanderS
  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
  • Upvote 1
medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
47 minutes ago, FilipAleksanderS said:

Okey so hear me out. Few months ago I was discussing this mantlet issue with Smin and you know what? All documents that Gaijin got from Bovington about Conqueror are included in this devblog: https://warthunder.com/en/devblog/current/870 . It means they don't even have detailed schemes of mantlet. Thats why they never listed that remodel in any changelog, they have no documentation to support current mantlet model.

 

Ps. Oh and I forgot to add, I also have asked Listy for help. Apparently he owns detailed schemes of mantlet from Bovington I guess, but he is not willing to waste time for Snail hahaha. Hmmm I wonder why?

 

well thats a shame :/

 

sent you a PM by the way :) 

 

medal medal medal medal medal medal medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, Ghost_Rider12 said:

 

well thats a shame :/

 

sent you a PM by the way :) 

 

Maybe I'm not right, but wasn't Listy publishing some book about Conqueror or overall british tanks? Maybe there is some info about mantlet. Maybe current mantlet is fine, but there should be additional plate inside, some kind of trunnion or somethig.

  • Upvote 1
medal medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, Loongsheep said:

Hitting the gun breech would trigger the fuze if it was an APHE.

hitting the gunbreach would hullbreak the tank directly, if not a bug is present

medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, FilipAleksanderS said:

Maybe I'm not right, but wasn't Listy publishing some book about Conqueror or overall british tanks? Maybe there is some info about mantlet. Maybe current mantlet is fine, but there should be additional plate inside, some kind of trunnion or somethig.

I’m pretty sure he has a book on the Conqueror. I’ve heard it mentioned before. 

 

Extra protrction would make sense if that mantlet is genuine in thickness. Personally, I still don’t buy it, the mantlet gets so thin in places before thickening up again. Unless there’s something else in there, that makes no sense from any point of view. It’d be a lot more difficult to cast, and adds a weakspot, without any apparent reason for it. It doesn’t even line up with any sort of trunnion pin since it’s so far forward. The only way that’d make sense would be if there’s part of the breach mechanisms housed up there. That still seems dubious, but might be true. If that is the case, the breach needs to be modeled correctly from what it presently is. (Shouldn't it be the same as the Conway anyways? That breach is modeled much larger than on Conqueror...) Unfortunately, all the looking I’ve done myself only yields turret and hull values, but never the mantlet itself. It’s frustrating since it seems like such poor engineering for the values represented in game...

  • Like 1
medal

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.