Jarms

British Bug Reports

Need some advice here.

 

According to this page

https://recordsearch.naa.gov.au/SearchNRetrieve/Interface/ViewImage.aspx?B=1086985&S=12&R=0

 

Minumum requirement is to be immune to any round capable of penetrating 120 mm at 60 degrees, and desired one is to be immune to 20 pounder APDS.

 

This seems quite simple, but if I understand it correctly, it is a protection not against frontal attacks (I mean 0 degrees attack), but for all strikes within 60 degrees arc, so also 30 degrees from left or right. So effective armor value in WT armor viewer should be 240 mm at absolute minimum not only when viewing the tank from the front, but also from angles 30 degrees to the left and to the right.

 

Am I going in right direction with my logic?

 

Now I know that 60 degrees arc was only designed for Chieftain Mk 1, and for Chieftain Mk 2 (and all others) the requirement was 120 mm at 60 degrees within 45 degrees arc (so 22,5 degrees left and right), so I will need some way to set the hangar camera to fixed 22,5 degrees angle to make screenshots for report. Any custom hangar specialists are welcome with ideas :) Or preferably - hangar with fixed angle view :)

 

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Chieftain turret report is in the making. I dumped this idea few weeks ago, but now decided to do it.

 

Anyway, one thing bugs me really - gun cradle. In game it is made as 100 mm plate, which probably is a huge BS, I don't believe any part of the turret is below required 250 mm of armor at 0 degrees.

 

But we need to prove it for Gaijin, as always.

 

This is everything I could find, that's from Rob Griffins book. Does anyone has anything else on this? Pictures, schemes, anything? Gun installing manual, restoration photos?

 

Any help is welcomed

 

unknown.png

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I've been given this scheme, it's most probably copied from real drawing. I need to find the real ones, but this one looks really promising

Spoiler

SwAoF.jpg

 

Plus I've received a missing photo of the gun cradle, which should definitely been modeled into the game, as this piece gives quite a bit of additional protection.

 

Spoiler

tExEVAJ1MQE.jpg

 

I am awaiting for more info from two very serious sources, maybe I could finally make a full report about it.

 

Thanks to @SkyRAY for help!

Edited by Godman_82
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On 19/07/2018 at 23:28, Godman_82 said:

I've been given this scheme, it's most probably copied from real drawing. I need to find the real ones, but this one looks really promising

  Reveal hidden contents

SwAoF.jpg

 

Plus I've received a missing photo of the gun cradle, which should definitely been modeled into the game, as this piece gives quite a bit of additional protection.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

tExEVAJ1MQE.jpg

 

I am awaiting for more info from two very serious sources, maybe I could finally make a full report about it.

 

Thanks to @SkyRAY for help!

On that, where is the gun trunnion for Challenger and Chieftain?  Just going on how easy it is for them to be killed through the gun. 

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20 minutes ago, Capt_Palmtree said:

On that, where is the gun trunnion for Challenger and Chieftain?

I am trying to ask the same question here - where is it? :)

 

On 20/07/2018 at 00:45, FilipAleksanderS said:

Wow, thats shaping up nicely! You are the man!

 

16 hours ago, TheFuzzieOne said:

Yo Godman, I feel sorry I have nothing more to contribute here, but you are doing some fantastic work on these things.

I have done nothing yet except for getting some images. It's a long road :) You would think going to museum and sending 200 pictures to devs would work, but it's not, so we have a long road ahead with this one :)

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10 hours ago, Godman_82 said:

I am trying to ask the same question here - where is it? :)

 

 

I have done nothing yet except for getting some images. It's a long road :) You would think going to museum and sending 200 pictures to devs would work, but it's not, so we have a long road ahead with this one :)

After your hard work on M103, APHE and M60A1 we treat you like a real hero! Even if Gaijin refuses your reports it doesn't change the fact that you can make real wonders! They are the ones that are hurting themselves by doing so.

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6 hours ago, FilipAleksanderS said:

After your hard work on M103, APHE and M60A1 we treat you like a real hero! Even if Gaijin refuses your reports it doesn't change the fact that you can make real wonders! They are the ones that are hurting themselves by doing so.

That's very nice, thanks :)

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Just for information, regarding the AEC MkII on the dev server a 3rd crewmember has been added in the turret, though they made a slight mistake as the loader is at the place of the commander and vice versa.

Still no smoke grenade luncher.

Edited by FuryMkI
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Anybody who owns the Sherman Firefly "Scorpion"  kind enough to provide a picture similar to this one ? (Speed in mph, realistic or simulator mode)

 

Spoiler

960936675_VCFirefly.jpg.e10ff6f32d775c91

 

Thanks in advance :salute:

 

Latest bug reports :

 

 

AEC Mk II incorrect maximum speed

https://forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/426863-aec-mk-ii-incorrect-maximum-speed/

 

AEC Mk II commander/loader incorrect placement

https://forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/426866-aec-mk-ii-commanderloader-incorrect-placement/

 

AEC Mk II incorrect commander view placement

https://forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/426869-aec-mk-ii-incorrect-commander-view-placement/

 

AEC MkII missing 2 inch bomb thrower

https://forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/426872-aec-mkii-missing-2-inch-bomb-thrower/

 

Forwarded to the devs bug report:

 

A30 Challenger incorrect traverse speed September/23/2018

https://forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/426971-fwd-2018-09-23-118116-a30-challenger-incorrect-traverse-speed/&tab=comments#comment-7805241

 

AEC MkII incorrect gun depression September/23/2018

https://forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/426967-fwd-2018-09-23-118116-aec-mkii-incorrect-gun-depression/&tab=comments#comment-7805216

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So, here is wha'ts new for us in today's update :

  • AEC Mk.II - The angle of gun elevation has been changed from  -12/+20 to -10/+20. Source: T.D.9553, Armoured Car A.E.C. MKII. A.F.V.W. 34., The Tank Museum Plans Packs: A.E.C. ARMOURED CAR Mk.II.
  • A30 Challenger - The traverse speed of the turret has been changed from 14 to 33 degrees per second. Source: BRANCH REPORTS ELECTRICAL, Report V/EL NO. 30. A.30 TRAVERSE GEAR PILOT B. General performance and reliability trials, The National Archives WO 194/170 // P.M. Knight, A30 Challenger Tank A Technical History, Black Prince Publications.

Impressive, less than a week to correct them.

 

  • FV4005 - Designation of the cannon has been changed from L4 to L4A1. The weight of the explosive mass in the armour-piercing HE shell has been changed from 12.7 to 17 kg. The type of the explosive mass for this shell has been changed from RDX/TNT to RDX/PWX. Source: Firing trials against Conqueror tanks with additional ballistic protection. Part 1. The use of large squash-head rounds. FVRDE, 1956.

Reported on the russian forum https://forum.warthunder.ru/index.php?/topic/246620-1791154-nekotorye-netochnosti-v-samokhodke-fv4005-stage-ii/

 

  • 3-inch HE (Churchill Mk.I) - The weight of the shell has been changed from 6.3 to 6.02 kg. The weight of the explosive mass has been changed from 530 to 606 grams. Source: Allied Ammunition Bulletin No.26, Chief Inspector of Armaments, Royal Arsenal Woolwich.

 

  • Churchill Mk.3 // Churchill Mk.I / Pz.Kpfw.Churchill // AEC Mk.II // Cromwell Mk.I // Crusader Mk.III - Limited vertical stabilization on the gun via a crew shoulder rest has been added.

Nice improvement, however the vertical targeting speed remain unchanged, only the Mathilda has a vertical speed of 15° while the vehicles above kept their 4° vertical speed, I believe if all of those vehicle are now considered as being shoulder manned vertically, they should also have a faster vertical targeting speed.

From BH5496  https://forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/423295-fwd-2018-08-29-179227-british-shoulder-mounted-vertical-guidance-too-slow/

 

 

  • Centurion Mk.3 // Strv 81 (Rb.52) - The number of shots for the first order ammo-racks has been changed from 11 to 8. Source: de la Riviere, D. (1951). A motion study of the ammunition stowage of Centurion 3.

Reported on the russian forum by Fu_Manchu https://forum.warthunder.ru/index.php?/topic/245969-1791136-centurion-mk3-bk-pervoi-ocheredi/ They didn't consider the 4s reload rate for the first order ammo rack though...

 

  • Chieftain Marksman - Number of respawns in Simulator Battles has been changed from 1 to 2.

Mr_Pokemon26295 report

https://forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/416721-23718-chieftain-marksman-only-1-spawn-in-simulator/

 

  • Sherman II // A33 Exсelsior - The 89 Smoke shell has been added. Source: Canadian Archives Microfilms, DEPARTMENT OF NATIONAL DEFENCE -ARMY- BRITISH A.F.V. SPECIFICATIONS.

 

Something not announced in the patch notes, the missing smoke grenade launcher has been added for the AEC, however they implemented it in a eeeh... kinda ambiguous way :P

Spoiler

1629674365_AECsmoke.jpg.a1d9df7c8109d1a5

 

Edited by FuryMkI
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1 hour ago, FuryMkI said:

Something not announced in the patch notes, the missing smoke grenade launcher has been added for the AEC, however they implemented it in a eeeh... kinda ambiguous way :P

  Hide contents

1629674365_AECsmoke.jpg.a1d9df7c8109d1a5

 

The AEC AC didn't have a conventional bomb thrower so a port was made in the roof in which a smoke bomb could sit, when the commander wanted to deploy smoke he would simply flick the base of the bomb, flinging it towards the enemy. :D

 

All very nice changes though :good:. I just wish I had gotten my RARDEN penetration and Churchill gun depression report in beforehand given the speed that your A30 Challenger and AEC report was acted upon :DD.

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Just experienced the most ridiculous bug in the Cent Mk 10.

 

The front of my Cent Mk. 10 turret got penned by the german LMG! It killed my loader during a reaload and it costed me the fight!

 

This match was a shitshow tainted by spawn camping, the fact happened briefly after I respawn the second time.

 

Replay:

 

 

 

 

 

 

#2018.10.03 23.13.52.wrpl

Edited by Azinfriit
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As stupid as it sounds... I think you should just form a bug report with the replay. They can not deny that. 

Edited by DELTACLUSTER
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I noticed a few of my reports were implemented too. I’m on my phone (and at work) so it’s hard for me to link them, what I saw though:

 

- Firefly VC had it’s rear stowage box and mudguards added to the vehicle model.

- Firefly IC “Scorpion” had it’s mudguards and roof mounted .50 added to the vehicle model.

- Churchill Mk. VII had the engine exhaust louvres added to the vehicle model. My report on the hull roof armour still hasn’t been implemented.

- Excelsior got it’s missing smoke shells.

 

@FuryMkI

Here you go. Found one on my Imgur.

zzbNHPo.jpg

 

Edited by Jarms
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Sorry for the double post. Hey guys I’m looking to submit a couple of reports on the Valentine tanks. Relating to armour values and the Mk. IX’s lack of shoulder stop. I had a computer crash recently (one of the reasons I disappeared) and lost a lot of my documents. Anyway, was wondering if anybody had a copy of:

- AFV Profile 6 Valentine Mark III

- Valentine by xxxx Taylor

- Into the Vally by xxxx Taylor

- Valentine Infantry Tank 1938 - 1945 by Bruce Newsome

- British Battle Tanks by David Fletcher

 

I have found other sources online, but some of them conflict or aren’t considered reliable.

 

Specifically I’m looking for details on the Valentine Mk. I’s drivers port thickness and a general armour diagram. For the Valentine Mk. IX I’m looking for details on the 6-Pdr shoulder stop. Any other sources would be appreciated.

Edited by Jarms
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On 01/10/2018 at 19:27, Time4Tea said:

The AEC AC didn't have a conventional bomb thrower so a port was made in the roof in which a smoke bomb could sit, when the commander wanted to deploy smoke he would simply flick the base of the bomb, flinging it towards the enemy. :D

 

All very nice changes though :good:. I just wish I had gotten my RARDEN penetration and Churchill gun depression report in beforehand given the speed that your A30 Challenger and AEC report was acted upon :DD.

 

Yeah, Gaijin's bug report process will always be a mistery... But why specifically only those 2 ? :dntknw: Though I am certain that the 14°/s was a placeholder like many other british turret speed... So maybe on their side they prioritise report on specific parameter they have a lack of info... For the AEC gun depression judging by Templar's answer he quickly went into contact with the dev as they requested more document, so fixing bug report might as well depend on how a tech mod deal with it ? Regarding the bomb thrower, it was reported a while ago by Magicool so it could as well be just a coincidence as my report is still open. Bah we'll never know... :dntknw:

 

By the way looks like the RARDEN penetration is also being reported on the russian forum https://forum.warthunder.ru/index.php?/topic/251187-181116-30mm-rarden-apds-t-nekorrektnoe-probitie/

 

4 hours ago, Jarms said:

 

@FuryMkI

Here you go. Found one on my Imgur.

zzbNHPo.jpg

 

 

Thanks a lot Jarms :salute:

 

There's always this for the AFV profile https://boxartden.com/reference/gallery/index.php/Modeling-References/AFV-Profiles/06-Valentine-Mk-III

 

And for the others, I'll send you a link where you can find British Battle Tanks by David Fletcher and Valentine Infantry Tank 1938 - 1945 by Bruce Newsome

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On 04/10/2018 at 07:18, DELTACLUSTER said:

As stupid as it sounds... I think you should just form a bug report with the replay. They can not deny that. 

 

Apparently the devs are already aware of this bug.

 

 

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On 01/10/2018 at 10:29, FuryMkI said:
  • 3-inch HE (Churchill Mk.I) - The weight of the shell has been changed from 6.3 to 6.02 kg. The weight of the explosive mass has been changed from 530 to 606 grams. Source: Allied Ammunition Bulletin No.26, Chief Inspector of Armaments, Royal Arsenal Woolwich.

No AP ammo?

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