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ID: 0062012 3/10/17 A7M2 engine power

A7M2 use a Ha-43-11 engine. It also name Ha-211.

mitsuEngine0.JPG.2b01413877c7a6edcee12bd

mitsuEngineHa211.thumb.jpg.dee6ffe297091

This document is about specifications of Mitsubishi late-war engine.
 
A7M.JPG.259209e859f5c8a65a0acb3dc89cef24
The red and blue line are WT HP curve recorded from 8111 during ~250kph ias climbing.
The gray line is real Hp curve in the document.
military rating :
There is a 100hp difference at sea level.
It also slightly under performance at 2000~5000m alt.
 
 
A7Mprediction.jpg.1b362017a9e5569f8f8640
The black line is roughly prediction of real WEP HP curve.
 
If military rating curve is changed, it will be logical to also change WEP rating curve.
Now the gap between WEP and military rating is about 300hp. (S.L. 1900->2200hp)  That should be adjust to 200hp difference.(S.L. 2000->2200hp)
This is my personal opinion.
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Hi,

    Thanks for the report.

 

Is there anywhere on this document that this statement is corroborated?

Quote

A7M2 use a Ha-43-11 engine. It also name Ha-211.

 

We would need proof.  Also, I am concerned that you indicate that this is a late war engine.   M2's are early war.

 

Who wrote over the masters?

 

What are the graphs?  Are these performance test that you have carried out?  If you have carried out a Flight Test did it comply with the guidelines for Flight Tests and please provide the clog and replay files of the test.

 

Cheers

 

 

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2 hours ago, KnightoftheAbyss said:

Is there anywhere on this document that this statement is corroborated?

It is mentioned in this data sheet. Ha-211 is army designation name.

mitsuEngine0.JPG.7bf0a136a6a4af9544ee149

from left to right : 

model type designation, Army design., Navy design., type, no.of cylinder, bore * stroke, swept volumn, dry weight, diameter, take-off  rpm/boost, rated rpm/boost.

 

 

I encounter some difficulty about replay. My A7M2 is not fully spaded. Thus I can only test full-spaded aircraft in test flight mode, which doesn't have option to save replay. If I use other software to record, will the replay be accepted ?  

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All test flights must comply with the guidelines.

 

Quote

Please ensure that your report complies with the following testing regime for Flight Test issues as detailed HERE

As well, reports must comply with the guidelines for making a Bug Report at the top of the Moderated Bug Reports - Windows Forum  HERE  Can I draw your attention to the guidelines for making a Historical Issues Report HERE  -  Please ensure your reports comply with these guidelines.

3. A detailed description of the fix you suggest. Provide sources including references that underline your position.
    *Please be reminded that Wikipedia or other private Websites are generally not considered as reliable sources.
   The required number of sources requires depends on the type of source presented:
    User Manual / Repair Manual / Factory Manual etc (Flight/Pilot/Maintenance Manuals Engineering Drawings etc) - Historically acknowledged reference sources - single source is required.
    Reference works (collections of vehicles) Biographies, Books, "expert" opinion publications, websites etc - at least two unrelated sources required. *

 

Please ensure the references have:  Report/Document Type, Report/Document Name, Author, Date, ISBN/ISSN, relevant Pg No's etc - so our Historical consultant can review and check the accuracy of those documents against the substantial Gaijin Historical Database and Reference Sources.
Please provide scans of all pages referenced and a scan of the front cover of publication/book.  

For Web sources. please provide the link to the actual relevant section or document.  If this is not possible and only higher links can be referenced then please provide page or title information to locate the relevant reference. 

Photographs must be fully referenced.

 

Baseline for Flight Model testing is normally RB or preferably SB, using MEC and with an Ace crew with full skills and a fully modified aircraft usually in a custom game.

 

And sorry I misread the report in the first case and read A7M2, as A6M2.  The A7 is of course a late war plane.

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Thanks we will review, test and get back to you.


Cheers

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After some discussion on this report. 

 

Do you have the title and date information etc of that Japanese report.  

 

At the moment the only identifier is the US Strategic Bombing Assessment where this document is located.  But the actual Japanese document does not appear to be detailed.

 

As the US is not the OEM then this would technically need a supporting reference.  (Falls into the Authored Works category)

Quote

Historical Issues Referencing Information

 

The required number of References depends on the type of sources presented:
OEM Manuals    -  User Manuals / Repair Manuals / Factory Manuals etc (Flight/Pilot/Maintenance Manuals, Engineering Drawings etc) - Historically acknowledged reference sources - single source is required. (Preferred)
Authored works   -  Reference Books on collections of vehicles/aircraft/ships ('coffee table books') Biographies, Specialist Books, "Expert" opinion publications, websites, industry magazines etc - at least two unrelated sources required.*

 

*Please be reminded that Wikipedia or other private Websites are generally not considered as reliable sources.

  • Please ensure the references haveReport/Document Type, Report/Document Name, Author, Date, ISBN/ISSN, relevant Pg No's etc - so our Historical consultant can review and check the accuracy of those documents against the substantial Gaijin Historical Database and Reference Sources.
  • Please provide scans of all pages referenced and a scan of the front cover of publication/book.  
  • For Web sources. Please provide the link to the actual relevant section or document.  If this is not possible and only higher links can be referenced then please provide page or title information to locate the relevant reference.
  • Photographs need to be fully referenced.

 

Do you happen to know the title and other identifying information of the Japanese report?

 

Thanks

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I 'm sorry I can not find exact same engine hp graph in other source.

The data of late-war japan aircraft are quiet scarce and hard to obtain.

However, the document is still highly reliable in my opinion. It is made by Mitsubishi, the manufacturer of these engines.

mitsuEngine1.thumb.jpg.a6d2f2ebe2a2c15b9

三菱重工業株式會社名古屋發動機製作所 昭和20年 8月

translation: Mitsubishi Heavy Industries Nagoya engine works ,1945.8

 

mitsuEngine2.thumb.jpg.e382b946f9c6c7155

Title:試作發動機要目性能一覽表,Test Engine Performance Specifications

Then it is collected by USSBS at 1945.10.26

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Additionally, many other data in this graph can be verified by other source. 

 

There are several sheet from "The Technical History of Mitsubishi Aero-Engines"

http://dlisv03.media.osaka-cu.ac.jp/contents/osakacu/kiyo/111C0000001-79.pdf

ha-50.JPG.945e576be5a2832ce9cc03ed7302e6

ha-104.JPG.e06de49dd3a9535ad6c1bf143a5e8

ha-112II.JPG.b7ca86d87429db7985ba9d67606

mitsuEngineHa211.thumb.jpg.9450e2737cbf4

Three different engine all match the number in the graph. This proves that the source credibility is high.

 

 

ha-43.JPG.1424ce4354d63c460d0fe391afc05a

This sheet is the specification of ha-43-11.  Ground HP = 2000.

However this is turbo variant, so FTH are different.

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Thanks very much

 

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On 2017/9/28 at 6:00 PM, KnightoftheAbyss said:

Thanks very much

 

Please accept my bug report. The graph is from engine manufacturer, and its credibility has been proven.

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Hi

 

Can you please clarify one last thing for me ?

 

You showed that red / yellow / green source matches the description and the graph.

 

If I understand it right, blue, which you did not highlight, should meet 2130HP at 1800m, and 1930 at 8300m.

This doesn't meet any line for the 211, including the variants with "vulkan type supercharger, with Inter Cooler".

Can you please clarify this difference, or what is the specification of your 211 on the table ?

 

regards

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9 hours ago, Rapitor said:

 

 

ha-43ru.JPG.29fbf0817504532b1fe4faddda54

ターボ = turbo

Judging from above-mentioned, the table refers to performance of ha-211 ru, which has turbo supercharger.


The HP graph doesn’t include the turbo variant of ha211. Vulkan supercharger means hydraulic-driven supercharger such as db601 has.

 

 

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Your Bug Report is submitted and a Bug ID has been assigned: 0062012

 

This thread will remain unlocked for 7 days in order to allow anyone with information / evidence / examples to post them.

It will also serve as a place where the developers may post questions for you to answer, so please keep up to date here.

 

Thank you for helping us improving the game.

 

Sincerely,

Rapitor, for the ™ team

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