MisakaMikoto_

ID: 0060846 & 0060847 P51H-5 wrong armament, ID: 0060904 P-51H speed vs altitude

Hi,

 

WEP wrong

 

According to the SAC data, Mustang H has both Wet and dry WEP. Where wet is 90 inches + ADI and dry is 67 inches. But the game in the air pressure only WEP (wet) 80 inches and Mil 61 inches.

 

http://www.alternatewars.com/SAC/F-51H_Mustang_SAC_-_3_July_1950.pdf

 

Weapons wrong

 

As mentioned in FLIGHT TEST DIVISION MEMORANDUM REPORT NO. TSFTE-2029, the P51H can carry 10 HVAR or 2 bombs and 6 HVARs. And by calculation we can see that two 1000-pound bombs and two 110-gallon fuel tank weight want, so you can carry two 1000-pound bombs and six HVAR.

http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/mustang/p-51h-64182.html

 

According to the SAC data, Mustang H machine guns for 6 machine guns 1820 bullets or 4 machine guns 1780 bullets. Rather than 6 machine guns 1880 bullets.

 

Speed wrong

 

Now the game's P51H sea level is very close to the speed of FLIGHT TEST DIVISION MEMORANDUM REPORT NO. TSFTE-2029. But at the high altitude there is a clear error, the speed closer to the previous theoretical calculation results rather than the actual test data. High altitude Level Flight is much higher than actual test data.

The same thing to note is the FLIGHT TEST DIVISION MEMORANDUM REPORT NO. TSFTE-2029 uses the P51H to carry two bomb racks and six rocket racks, rather than the normal test configuration of the two bomb racks. This results in a low test speed.

 

A Chinese friend found some other test results.

f17d864bd11373f0029b47efa30f4bfbfaed04d3

 

AAF NO.44-64164 This wild horse carrying a bomb rack test out 487MPH @ 25KFT.
He then compared the data to AAF NO.44-64161, which also carried the bomb pendant but was in poor condition, drawing Level Flight of AAF NO.44-64164.

He then figured out Level 45 of AAF NO.44-64164 at 90 inches of intake.

2aef49d9f2d3572ca874b4ac8d13632763d0c3ee

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Hi There.

 

Many issues here, which is annoying because we have the 1 issue policy to prevent what I am about to do: splitting up your report to answer them seperatedly

 

 

4 hours ago, MisakaMikoto_ said:

Hi,

 

WEP wrong

 

According to the SAC data, Mustang H has both Wet and dry WEP. Where wet is 90 inches + ADI and dry is 67 inches. But the game in the air pressure only WEP (wet) 80 inches and Mil 61 inches.

 

http://www.alternatewars.com/SAC/F-51H_Mustang_SAC_-_3_July_1950.pdf

P-51H can do both 80" and 90" M.P. Using 80" is legit. Keep in mind that many top tier prop plane have not their maximum engine poerformance available at the moment.

 

Regarding the dry WEP, I would even add that P-51H can run at 67", 70" and 75" with dry WEP.

I reported this issue myself already, but the game engine does not support dry and ADI wep in the same time. This will be changed in the future.

 

4 hours ago, MisakaMikoto_ said:

Weapons wrong

 

As mentioned in FLIGHT TEST DIVISION MEMORANDUM REPORT NO. TSFTE-2029, the P51H can carry 10 HVAR or 2 bombs and 6 HVARs. And by calculation we can see that two 1000-pound bombs and two 110-gallon fuel tank weight want, so you can carry two 1000-pound bombs and six HVAR.

http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/mustang/p-51h-64182.html

Granted. Manual agrees with you http://www.avialogs.com/index.php/en/aircraft/usa/northamericanaviation/p-51mustang/flight-handbook-usaf-series-f-51h-aircraft.html

Bear in mind that there is a difference between load (weight) limitation and load (space) limitation. Which is why using calculation only is not accepted.

 

4 hours ago, MisakaMikoto_ said:

According to the SAC data, Mustang H machine guns for 6 machine guns 1820 bullets or 4 machine guns 1780 bullets. Rather than 6 machine guns 1880 bullets.

Granted, as per manual too

 

4 hours ago, MisakaMikoto_ said:

Speed wrong

 

Now the game's P51H sea level is very close to the speed of FLIGHT TEST DIVISION MEMORANDUM REPORT NO. TSFTE-2029. But at the high altitude there is a clear error, the speed closer to the previous theoretical calculation results rather than the actual test data. High altitude Level Flight is much higher than actual test data.

The same thing to note is the FLIGHT TEST DIVISION MEMORANDUM REPORT NO. TSFTE-2029 uses the P51H to carry two bomb racks and six rocket racks, rather than the normal test configuration of the two bomb racks. This results in a low test speed.

 

A Chinese friend found some other test results.

f17d864bd11373f0029b47efa30f4bfbfaed04d3

 

AAF NO.44-64164 This wild horse carrying a bomb rack test out 487MPH @ 25KFT.
He then compared the data to AAF NO.44-64161, which also carried the bomb pendant but was in poor condition, drawing Level Flight of AAF NO.44-64164.He then figured out Level 45 of AAF NO.44-64164 at 90 inches of intake.

Spoiler

2aef49d9f2d3572ca874b4ac8d13632763d0c3ee

Devs used this:

p-51h-booklet-pg11.jpg

Which is, with all due respect, better than a 67" figure with hand made lines.

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P-51H missing bomb / rocket configuration: ID:60846

P-51H incorrect ammunition count: ID:60847

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Hi,

The lines you provided above are the estimates, and there is a clear error with the two lines of P51H that I have found.

P-51H_64161_Speed-vs-Altitude.thumb.jpg.

p-51h-64182-fig16a.thumb.jpg.17006acbba3

p-51h-booklet-pg11.thumb.jpg.7b8a012c091

You can refer to the SAC line and above the two sets of actual test lines that I sent. You will find that the line you provide is at high altitude and the speed is obviously too high. Because the line you provide is an untested calculated value, it does not conform to the actual P51H booster mode.

 

http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/mustang/p-51h-64161.html

http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/mustang/p-51h-64182.html

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59aae8f61bb9b_QQ20170903011252.png.9fe1d

59aae8f70bfbc_QQ20170903011305.png.0505a

This is the picture of IL2, the first is carrying 1000 pounds AN-M64, the second for 110gal.Fuel tank. You can see the diameter of the two close and 110gal. Fuel tank the tank is longer.

 

If you think the above can not meet your needs, you can try to test the P51H model in the game. I do not think there is any room problem.

 

Edited by MisakaMikoto_
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I'll investigate the speed issue, thank you.

 

I recognize that the source, page 11, is part of an incomplete booklet, so I don't know all about it. Your flight testing might be revelant for tuning.

 

About the bombload, it is alright. As I said, it is "granted" and was reported, I found documentation in the flight handbook to support your claim

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Regarding the speed issue.

 

At what speed did you test the P-51H, and where is the issue please ?

 

I do not want to test every single speed and altitude myself

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@MisakaMikoto_

As I said before, the policiy for bug report is 1 issue per thread.

 

Your digression about fuel will not be processed further.

 

Also, as I said, the bomb load and the mamuniiton count have been reported already, with an ID assigned.

 

Finally, I did some testing myself with the P-51H, and I do not obtain the same speed then you, especially at 25000-30000ft.

 

Moreover, you tested a P-51H at 50% fuel (your reference give a gross weight of 100% fuel / ~9500lb at take off) and the report is about a P-51H with wing rack.)

Therefore, your testing IG making the plane slightly faster than your figure for 67" is actually expected

 

This said, I reported the speed issue due to the weird behavior I found when investigating.

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Summary of the issues:

 

ID: 0060904: P-51H speed vs altitude not matching test flight

 

ID: 0060846: P-51H missing bomb + rocket configuration, such as 2x 1000 and 6 rockets or 10 rockets (and others)

 

ID: 0060847: P-51H incorrect ammunition count

 

Please be aware that not further issue will be processed in this report.

For new issues, please respect the report policy, and create 1 thread per issue.

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Re-opened

 

Request by Devs.

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