Northman505

Are British Tanks Good?

41 minutes ago, NightLurk said:

 

What he means to say is that it takes an exceptional player to manage to super-over-compensate for the tanks being complete **** and get them to just perform at a mediocre level instead of being completely useless.

 

If you are not good enough to be British, try the Russian line for maximum hold handing.

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4 hours ago, NightLurk said:

 

What he means to say is that it takes an exceptional player to manage to super-over-compensate for the tanks being complete **** and get them to just perform at a mediocre level instead of being completely useless.

 

In other words, British tanks are underpowered and need buffs.  It's not hard, just decrease their BRs by .3 or .7 as needed.  Some things like the T17 and AC AA are fine where they are.  And some things like the Firefly should seriously be at 4.3, maybe even 4.0.

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9 hours ago, NikolaiLev said:

 

In other words, British tanks are underpowered and need buffs.  It's not hard, just decrease their BRs by .3 or .7 as needed.  Some things like the T17 and AC AA are fine where they are.  And some things like the Firefly should seriously be at 4.3, maybe even 4.0.

Yes, lower br would be a start!
Do you think today a panzer 4 f2 (br 3.7) killed my centurion mk3 (br 6.3), with a single frontal shot!
Then with Fv4202 vs panzer G, 5 shots to kill him! And if I had been with the Caernarvon (which has no armor fv4202) I would be surely die, because
1/2 shots (between the 50 seconds that I need to shoot my 5) he has also shot me
hahahaha
But it's all right ... because surely some might say it's my fault
hahaha

 

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3 hours ago, nleon said:

Yes, lower br would be a start!
Do you think today a panzer 4 f2 (br 3.7) killed my centurion mk3 (br 6.3), with a single frontal shot!
Then with Fv4202 vs panzer G, 5 shots to kill him! And if I had been with the Caernarvon (which has no armor fv4202) I would be surely die, because
1/2 shots (between the 50 seconds that I need to shoot my 5) he has also shot me
hahahaha
But it's all right ... because surely some might say it's my fault
hahaha

 

 

Yeah totally you're just bad, British tanks aren't underpowered at all.  Also War Thunder is a perfectly balanced game and has no flaws whatsoever.  Also I am the Queen of France.

 

In seriousness, I'm worried Brit tanks won't get any attention (even though tweaking BRs would be incredibly easy) because the game has been "officially released."  But we'll see.

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the british tanks - i have played them up to BR4, are no thread in any way. when I play the US and or German and I see a british enemy tank I ignore him so that he has the Chance to stay on the battlefield longer as the usual 30 seconds.

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39 minutes ago, OBC_BirdGunner said:

the british tanks - i have played them up to BR4, are no thread in any way. when I play the US and or German and I see a british enemy tank I ignore him so that he has the Chance to stay on the battlefield longer as the usual 30 seconds.

 

Yeah I honestly feel horrible every time I demolish a British tank.  I just feel so sad when an enemy Cromwell gets the jump on me, even pens me, but my turret crew just turn orange and I one-shot him back.

 

I can't remember the last time I've gotten killed by a British tank, especially when I wasn't just outnumbered.

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10 minutes ago, NikolaiLev said:

 

Yeah totally you're just bad, British tanks aren't underpowered at all.  Also War Thunder is a perfectly balanced game and has no flaws whatsoever.  Also I am the Queen of France.

 

In seriousness, I'm worried Brit tanks won't get any attention (even though tweaking BRs would be incredibly easy) because the game has been "officially released."  But we'll see.

Ahahaahahahaha!

Aniway..

Hopefully fix or I do return money back ;)

I'm tired of playing the Russians or the Germans! WT is full! I dont understand why they so badly the British is a decision too counterproductive, for me, for variety game... ect!

For this reason I'm interested this topic (English)! Otherwise for me WT is already dead!

Regards

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52 minutes ago, OBC_BirdGunner said:

the british tanks - i have played them up to BR4, are no thread in any way. when I play the US and or German and I see a british enemy tank I ignore him so that he has the Chance to stay on the battlefield longer as the usual 30 seconds.

Oh thanks ahahaha

I'm ashamed to use them! but I want to get to the Chieftain. but I think also that ****...  although I hope not 

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2 hours ago, nleon said:

Ahahaahahahaha!

Aniway..

Hopefully fix or I do return money back ;)

I'm tired of playing the Russians or the Germans! WT is full! I dont understand why they so badly the British is a decision too counterproductive, for me, for variety game... ect!

For this reason I'm interested this topic (English)! Otherwise for me WT is already dead!

Regards

 

I don't really think Gaijin does it on purpose, or somehow hates British players.  They're just not good at balance design.  They probably haven't hired a dedicated balance designer.  The player council may also have something to do with it; if key people are under the impression British tanks are balanced, then they won't get buffed.

 

I've also heard repeatedly that Gaijin only adjusts BR based on kill and loss rates, likely aiming for all tanks to have a 1:1 average k:d, as that is ostensibly balanced.  But this is a very flawed premise because it leads to situations where, say, British tanks are underpowered and hard to use, so only people truly committed to the game and the nation keep playing them, and they naturally get skilled enough to at least manage that 1:1 k:d.  But there's an overrepresentation of skilled players in Britain, and I'm sure if you took those players and put them in another nation's tanks they'd absolutely dominate.

 

Balance is a really difficult thing to achieve.  And you can't always take community feedback at face value because people have agendas and biases and some people just don't know how to play the game.  Just look at those threads that think the Wildcat needs a buff because it can't outturn the Zero.

 

But then sometimes community feedback is well-reasoned, with reasonable points that are backed up by things that happen in the game.  Things infographics may not tell you.

 

It's also worth mentioning that the only people left working on WT are probably a couple coders and asset creators.  The game designers are likely off designing other products, feeling that WT is "good enough" as it is.  After all, WT's playerbase has never been bigger.

 

It's a real shame when developers settle for profitable mediocrity.

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14 hours ago, NikolaiLev said:

 

I don't really think Gaijin does it on purpose, or somehow hates British players.  They're just not good at balance design.  They probably haven't hired a dedicated balance designer.  The player council may also have something to do with it; if key people are under the impression British tanks are balanced, then they won't get buffed.

 

I've also heard repeatedly that Gaijin only adjusts BR based on kill and loss rates, likely aiming for all tanks to have a 1:1 average k:d, as that is ostensibly balanced.  But this is a very flawed premise because it leads to situations where, say, British tanks are underpowered and hard to use, so only people truly committed to the game and the nation keep playing them, and they naturally get skilled enough to at least manage that 1:1 k:d.  But there's an overrepresentation of skilled players in Britain, and I'm sure if you took those players and put them in another nation's tanks they'd absolutely dominate.

 

Balance is a really difficult thing to achieve.  And you can't always take community feedback at face value because people have agendas and biases and some people just don't know how to play the game.  Just look at those threads that think the Wildcat needs a buff because it can't outturn the Zero.

 

But then sometimes community feedback is well-reasoned, with reasonable points that are backed up by things that happen in the game.  Things infographics may not tell you.

 

It's also worth mentioning that the only people left working on WT are probably a couple coders and asset creators.  The game designers are likely off designing other products, feeling that WT is "good enough" as it is.  After all, WT's playerbase has never been bigger.

 

It's a real shame when developers settle for profitable mediocrity.

Your reasoning is accurate and honest!
I also think that on the scale of the br is placed the English have more gun depression and speed of charging!
But!!!!!!111!!!
Now I make a metaphor:
We think of WT as a tennis match and I are English that on paper I have a good chance because I have a good racket makes angled shots (gun depression), I can launch the ball very powerful (ammo penetration)!
But for some strange reason most of my shots dont make points (nerf gun) and opponent responds (although he has bullets less powerful and less angulated) with winning shots!!! it is obvious that my tennis player almost always loses the game!
End of metaphor!
So if the bullets dont work and the armor not bounce you're just meat for cannon to the other players
And this is so intentionally
Regards


New british update:
I just shot to the front of a Japanese Ni Ho lll (10-15 armor and br 2.3 !!!) but rebounded, then he shoots me and does not bounce, I died oneshot of FV4202 (with expert qualification)
HAHAHAHA I'm getting tired of this ****!

 

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3 hours ago, Ghost_Rider12 said:

The Chieftain and the Conqueror are both well worth the grind. The L11 and the L1A1 are both very good guns :DD

Ok! at least I have a reason to go forward with Brit tanks!

Thanks

3 hours ago, Ghost_Rider12 said:

 

 

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3 hours ago, Ghost_Rider12 said:

The Chieftain and the Conqueror are both well worth the grind. The L11 and the L1A1 are both very good guns :DD

 

I do like my Chieftain to be fair

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18 minutes ago, NikolaiLev said:

6da3c998c1.jpg

 

"British tanks are fine"

 

:facepalm:

 

Using APBC, shooting at a Panther's UFP and complaining that it didn't work. What tank do you think you are driving? An USSR with 100mm or 125mm cannon?

Sigh, a typical Brit tanker.... And people are still wondering why they lose that many matches....

Edited by biboloxo
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2 hours ago, biboloxo said:

 

Using APBC, shooting at a Panther's UFP and complaining that it didn't work. What tank do you think you are driving? An USSR with 100mm or 125mm cannon?

Sigh, a typical Brit tanker.... And people are still wondering why they lose that many matches....

look closer that round went strait into driver head. 

Edited by Ta_Kanata18
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14 hours ago, biboloxo said:

 

Using APBC, shooting at a Panther's UFP and complaining that it didn't work. What tank do you think you are driving? An USSR with 100mm or 125mm cannon?

Sigh, a typical Brit tanker.... And people are still wondering why they lose that many matches....

 

Wow, it's almost like people think there's an issue when a nation whose strength is supposed to be "superior penetration" fails to have good penetration.

 

Are you gonna sit there and tell me "you're supposed to flank" when no other nation needs to, while having less damaging shells?  Where is the logic in that?

 

I have still heard literally no convincing logical arguments as to why British tanks are not underpowered.  If I'm going to have shells that do less damage then they ought to penetrate better, or there should be some other significant benefit.  Gun depression and mobility aren't that important and the Firefly doesn't even have those.

 

12 hours ago, Ta_Kanata18 said:

look closer that round went strait into driver head. 

 

Yet didn't actually do damage.  This is a common phenomenon with the 17lbr, especially pre-APDS (which the Achilles, Avenger, Firefly and Archer all need to deal with).  I seriously think it's bugged because of how absurdly ineffective it is.

 

It's like the spalling is just weaker.  I suspect it's because of the somewhat recent overmatch mechanic changes, which are realistic and make sense, but resulted in British tanks being god awful.

 

BR changes really are the only solution I see to this.  The Firefly can kill Panzer 4s fine enough, and the Panzer 4 is more than a match for the Firefly.  It should not be fighting Tigers and Panthers unless its gun starts performing better.

Edited by NikolaiLev

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2 hours ago, NikolaiLev said:

Yet didn't actually do damage.  This is a common phenomenon with the 17lbr, especially pre-APDS (which the Achilles, Avenger, Firefly and Archer all need to deal with).  I seriously think it's bugged because of how absurdly ineffective it is.

 

It's like the spalling is just weaker.  I suspect it's because of the somewhat recent overmatch mechanic changes, which are realistic and make sense, but resulted in British tanks being god awful.

 

BR changes really are the only solution I see to this.  The Firefly can kill Panzer 4s fine enough, and the Panzer 4 is more than a match for the Firefly.  It should not be fighting Tigers and Panthers unless its gun starts performing better.

This was supposed to be fixed in 1.65

  • Crew members can now be penetrated by rounds that have 7.5mm value or more.

But nope superhuman crew and deflect that round no problem.

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15 hours ago, Ta_Kanata18 said:

look closer that round went strait into driver head. 

 

No, it wasn't. If a crew get hit by a shell, even if that shell is an AP shell, the crew's color will either turn into yellow/red or black. As you can see on the killcam, the driver still had gray color, which means that the shell didn't hit him. And if you look closer to the list at the right of the screenshot, you can see only the gun breech got damaged. That means the shell didn't pen the UFP, bounced off of the UFP into the cannnon breech and damaged it.

 

If you can't even tell what happen while watching a killcam after 10k battles, I suggest you to stop playing and learn how the game mechanic works again.

Edited by biboloxo
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2 hours ago, biboloxo said:

 

No, it wasn't. If a crew get hit by a shell, even if that shell is an AP shell, the crew's color will either turn into yellow/red or black. As you can see on the killcam, the driver still had gray color, which means that the shell didn't hit him. And if you look closer to the list at the right of the screenshot, you can see only the gun breech got damaged. That means the shell didn't pen the UFP, bounced off of the UFP into the cannnon breech and damaged it.

 

If you can't even tell what happen while watching a killcam after 10k battles, I suggest you to stop playing and learn how the game mechanic works again.

 

No, that's not actually what happened, the shell penetrated the UFP.  I was the one who made that screenshot.  Anybody can test this by using the same User mission test range, turning on fast reload, and just dumping rounds into the front of a Panther D.  I don't have the hardware to take a video but if I did that's what I'd do.

 

The cannon breech was damaged by one of the dozens of fired shells.  Dozens.  Look at all the impact marks.  And the panther still didn't die.  That's how garbage the 17 lbr is.

 

And as you can see, this is all at close range.  At real battle ranges this is going to perform even worse.

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On 12/26/2016 at 3:23 AM, Tommes_Spartan said:

Gaijin needs to fix this ridiculous killing mechanics. Period. But they won't. They don't care.

 

Honestly, they don't need to fix the killing mechanics.  It's okay that there's no morale system.  But something needs to be done, and it's as easy as adjusting BRs down for British tanks that need it.  Namely, just about everything in Tier 4 and down, with the exception of things like the T17 (which has become an absurd menace to the new Japanese tanks) and the AC AA.

 

That said, if you're having trouble with the British tanks then try out Japan.  Gaijin managed to come up with tanks that are even more underpowered.  Never had I ever expected to play a tank that made me look upon the M3 as an unstoppable, heavily-armored juggernaut that can't be defeated from the front, or even the side at any angle other than flat and at close range.  The I-Go is a nightmare to drive.

 

Japan vs. Britain would actually be a somewhat reasonable matchup.  But, you know, that's not what happens in-game.

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1 hour ago, NikolaiLev said:

That said, if you're having trouble with the British tanks then try out Japan.  Gaijin managed to come up with tanks that are even more underpowered.  Never had I ever expected to play a tank that made me look upon the M3 as an unstoppable, heavily-armored juggernaut that can't be defeated from the front, or even the side at any angle other than flat and at close range.  The I-Go is a nightmare to drive.

Made my day. But the scariest part of the story is that it's true. Recently I have started grinding british tanks and... well, I feel respect only versus german tanks. Japanese ones are so kawaii to kill. They desintegrate just by looking at them. But they do have the Type74 eventually, right? Tight.

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At least the Japanese tanks are armed with guns though, British tanks are pretty much limited to harsh language because their so called 'guns' are completely worthless.

 

Simple enough to fix though, instead of all this faffing about with morale systems or downtiering, just give all the British tanks APHE rounds like every other nation, lower penetration than the solid shot, but the explosive filler means they're more effective than wet farts. Boom, instantly British tanks are competitive with other nations because their guns are actually capable of killing things.

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54 minutes ago, DarkFenix2k5 said:

At least the Japanese tanks are armed with guns though, British tanks are pretty much limited to harsh language because their so called 'guns' are completely worthless.

 

Simple enough to fix though, instead of all this faffing about with morale systems or downtiering, just give all the British tanks APHE rounds like every other nation, lower penetration than the solid shot, but the explosive filler means they're more effective than wet farts. Boom, instantly British tanks are competitive with other nations because their guns are actually capable of killing things.

Brits didn't use aphe.  They don't make up imaginary ammo in this game, if you can't find evidence it was used ots not gonna be in the game.

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