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Historically Inaccurate Loadouts


Haha, I remember many, many months ago.

I posted things like that too. About the Lancaster, B-17, Yer-2... good times.

 

But sadly you wont change anything either.

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I would grind my Lovely Lanc  more if she had the Grand Slam. :3

 

 

Very nice post, OP. I wish Gaijin would listen to this. And this is WITHOUT MODS too. So yea, we're seeing something spectacular here folks.

 

 

+1, wish I could give more.

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What's frustrating is that the payload was correct, and then they broke it.

 

At least they'll "fix" it.

Senio said the B-17 will get external bomb mount option, I think (and hope) that that's what he meant.

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At least they'll "fix" it.

Senio said the B-17 will get external bomb mount option, I think (and hope) that that's what he meant.

 

Good to hear. Any word on the Lancaster? 

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Good to hear. Any word on the Lancaster? 

 

Nope, but I think Senio once responded to a post about it with tons of charts and images, saying

"The Lancaster will have more bomb load options in the near future"

 

Unfortunately, that was before 1.37 was released and he meant the BS loadout option we got there.

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Yeah and Do 217 should have 3000kg or 4000kg depending on model and now they have 2000kg...

EVERYTHING gets lowered values except you know.. Yers.

 

There is no bias, RIGHT ?

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Nope, but I think Senio once responded to a post about it with tons of charts and images, saying

"The Lancaster will have more bomb load options in the near future"

 

Unfortunately, that was before 1.37 was released and he meant the BS loadout option we got there.

That was like 2013 Spring..

Have to call the bull out on that one.

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Guys, this is a really useful thread which has come to the attention of the devs and has been used by them on more than one occasion. We really do appreciate the frustration of not having all of your hard work implemented as quickly as everybody would like, but please don't degenerate this thread into personal arguments. I've hidden a few of these argumentative posts - please keep things civil, it would be a crying shame if this, of all threads, gets locked. 

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So, I have recently discoverd that the B-17G could only carry 6x1000lb bombs with the internal bay (Still 2 more than in game). It also, however, had an option to carry 8x1600 lb bombs internally. Or 10 with external racks.

15doxme.png

 

Here is a diagram of the racks:

 

2dtojgy.png

 

As you can see the in-game payloads are not correct at all.

Edited by Squanto_
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  • 2 weeks later...

Also, The S.79's Carried 100kg bombs rather then 50kg bombs, 

 

12 x 100kg, instead we have 12 x 50kg, I would place this towards the fact no other German bombers have 100kg bombs, so the Italians don't get them yet.

 

Also, The defensive and offensive weapons on the S.79's are almost all wrong.

 

The S.M.79 1936 had: 1 forward firing fixed 12.7mm Breda-SAFAT, 1 12.7mm Breda-SAFAT in the Hump, 12.7mm Breda-SAFAT in the belly gondola and 1 7.7mm Lewis MG on a swivel mount so it could fire from each side of the aircraft with ease.

 

The S.M.79 1937 had: 1 forward firing fixed 12.7mm Breda-SAFAT, 1 12.7mm Breda-SAFAT in the Hump, 12.7mm Breda-SAFAT in the belly gondola and the single 7.7mm Lewis MG on the swivel mount was replaced by two 7.7mm Breda-SAFAT MG's (one for each side of the aircraft)

 

The S.M.79 1939 Model had the same defensive and offensive armament as the 1937 model. 

 

The S.M.79 1941 Model had the same defensive and offensive armament as the 1937 model. 

 

The S.M.79 Bis Model had: 1 forward firing fixed 12.7mm Breda-SAFAT, 1 12.7mm Breda-SAFAT in the Hump, 1 12.7mm Breda-SAFAT in the belly gondola and two 12.7mm Breda-SAFAT MG's in the side positions (Replacing the 7.7mm Breda-SAFAT MG's)  (Most simply had the belly gondola removed however)

 

The S.M.79 Bis/Late Model Had: 1 x 20mm MG151/20 Cannon (Replacing the 12.7mm Breda-SAFAT MG), 1 12.7mm Breda-SAFAT in the Hump and two 12.7mm Breda-SAFAT MG's in the side positions (Replacing the 7.7mm Breda-SAFAT MG's) The belly gondola was completely deleted in this model. 

 

 

Might have messed some of those up, but as it stands all the S.79's have 12.7mm Breda-SAFATS all over were they should not, and the Bis/Late is missing the 20mm forward cannon. Also, the Bis and Bis/late has access to carry two torpedoes if the mission called for it. 

 

there is still another quite big problem with the S.79

 

The lateral machine-guns in the game can fire pratically only directly on the sides of the plane and not towards the back.
Maximum maybe 10° towards the rear...

 

In reality they could fire almost on the tail of the plane, almost on their 6.

If you see in this picture below, the right 7,7 machinegun on a S.79 is pointed towards the rear, and under the barrel you can see a metal piece positioned there just in order to not let the gun fire on the tail of the aircraft (and on the elevators).

 

In the game, their arc of fire are wrong.

 

2818_1263972162.jpg

 

And it's true, they are always 12,7mm guns in the game. 
While the S.79 started with a single Lewis, then 2 x 7,7mm, and finally with 2 x 12,7mm.

Edited by Ioshic
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Maybe they should introduce a standard. Some bombers like the Yers are flying around with their overload. Others like the Jelly Welly carry short range load. And close to everybody else has long range load.

 

Since the Japanese only have long range load the best solution would be to give every bomber it's long range load, but any other choice would be acceptable too, as long it's the same for everybody.

 

The way it is right now is neither fair nor historical.

For RB and SB the choice of all the available loads would be very welcome, but I can see how a 9ton bomb load of an overloaded B-17 would be bad balance for AB due to overeffective base bombing.

 

But why are they not at least in relation? Why do the Yers carry overload while the B-17s carry long range load?

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I have a question for all those calling for planes to have their maximum bomb loads.  Bomb loads size decreased with range (as fuel was carried to increase that range) so since Bombers start in air they obviously started from Strategic bases to the rear, then how far have they flown to get to the 'Map"?   Bombers starting from England could carry maximum bombs for targets in France and Belgium for example,  but targets in southern Germany would be carrying their minimum loads, Therefore what distance is being used for targets on missions? :dntknw:  The Yers while designed as long range bombers (and flew a few strategic missions in Troikas (like a Doolittle raid on Berlin in 1941) but their claim to fame came from the battle of Moscow where they were flying at ranges of 200 miles on tactical missions.

Edited by Grampa_
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Again guys, this isn't the place for talking about bombloads. It isn't the place for talking about balance or underlying game mechanics that would explain the various bomb loads.

This is a thread for reporting and logging planes mounting the wrong guns or carrying too much ammo. Inaccuracies that were impossible and therefore shouldn't be in this game.

Missing bombs loads are exactly that, missing, not wrong. This is a beta with lots of content still to come. Unless a plane is carrying too many bombs, something that wasn't physically possible, it doesn't belong in this thread.

 

Please take it somewhere else, the spam about bombloads is choking this thread.

Edited by Muleo
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The F8F-1 should have AN/M2 machine guns instead of AN/M31. I think that a very understandable mix up has happened between the AN/M3 HMG (first use on the F86) and AN/M3 Cannons (like the F8F-1b and F8F-2 carried).

 

The F86A was the first US aircraft to carry the AN/M3 HMG as weaponry to my knowledge, I will attempt to track down a primary source for this still.

 

1http://www.aviation-history.com/grumman/f8f.html

Edited by Tarskin
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That is correct considering that the Americans didn't have to differentiate. The AN/M3 machine guns were not in service yet (AN/M3 was standardized in April 19451 while the first F8F production aircraft was finished in February 1945), therefore we can deduce that the manual (page 49 is what you are referring to I assume?) refers to the AN/M2's.

 

I mean else we could give AN/M3's to P-47's (and a lot more) as well since that manual also just states '.50 cal' (page 56 of pilot's training manual for the P47N)

 

1http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/aircraft/systems/m3.htm

 

PS: Added a source indicating that the F8F-1 construction pre-dates AN/M3 HMG standardization.

Edited by Tarskin
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Additional information regarding wrong weaponry on the F8F-1

 

---

 

Andrews1 states this about the design:

 

The goal was a fighter similar in size to the Wildcat, but having superior speed, rate of climb and manoeuvring capability in the low/medium altitude range to any of the carrier fighters in service or under development. It was desired to provide the same pilot protection as that in the Hellcat, but the armament was reduced to four .50 cal guns, these being considered adequate to destroy the less rugged and less protected Japanese aircraft.

 

 

The fact that it speaks of reduced armament in regards to a Hellcat also further indicates that the F8F-1 was armed with AN/M2's.

 

Sources:

 

1 Andrews, 1972. Profile publications

 

PS: If you are convinced that all of this together is not sufficient evidence then I would really like to see any form of proof of at least equal quality stating that it should have AN/M3 .50's.

Edited by Tarskin
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There even are references to it having AN/M3's? I am 99.9% convinced that the developers mistook the M3 cannons (of F8F-1b and up) for the AN/M3 Machine Guns.

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