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Experimental German APDS Ammunition

 As writen this topic is about APDS ammunition made by germany in WW2

I am seeking inforamtion about this ammunition like penetration valuse

the followign qoute is from myself as i postet this in another thread and that is all info i own about it

 

Everthing from GERMAN EXPLOSIVE ORDNANCE (PROJECTILES AND PROJECTILE FUZES) from 1953

[spoiler]

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thats all

[/spoiler]

 

and here something for the Maus

[spoiler]rbkpkdku.png[/spoiler]

 

 

thats all :salute:

 

 

 

 

 

i thank u in advance and i hope this thread gets not to much derailed :salute:
 

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Do we really want experimental, scarcely used test ammunition?

Becouse compared to this, even post war ammo has more sense to me.

Edited by juraleona
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245mm pen at 1000m? i doubt iit will pen the IS4 since angling (i think its armor equates to about 500 or 600 mm)

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Do we really want experimental, scarcely used test ammunition?

Becouse compared to this, even post war ammo has more sense to me.

 

If you want Germany to compete, yes.

 

And I am very sure 1949 APCBC-HE-T was "scarcely used" in 1944. [SU 100... it never even used the BR-412D ffs, it was a T-54+ only round]

 

Besides, it's needed to make the Jagdtiger competitive in Tier V. Since you know, the T-54A and T-55 will come, with APDS to fight it.

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Your answer was "Do you want experimental ammo?" I answered that it's needed for balance in Tier V.

Yeah, sorry, I didn't see your post, only first response.

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105mm Pzgr.39 (TS)

 

Basically a 75mm projectile.

10.5cm%20PzGr39%20%28TS%29.png?psid=1

 

150mm Pzgr.39 (TS)

 

Basically a 88mm projectile

15cm%20Pzgr39%20%28TS%29.png?psid=1

 

 

Little bit of information about them but other than this I really don't know much about them.

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If you want Germany to compete, yes.
 
And I am very sure 1949 APCBC-HE-T was "scarcely used" in 1944. [SU 100... it never even used the BR-412D ffs, it was a T-54+ only round]
 
Besides, it's needed to make the Jagdtiger competitive in Tier V. Since you know, the T-54A and T-55 will come, with APDS to fight it.

There's still hope Gaijin won't make the Jagdtiger fight the T-62 or any other Cold War tank. I mean, they have been making good decisions as of late.
But anyway, if thenT-44 got that experimental (or was it rare) ammo recently, I don't see why the Jagdtiger can't get a Sabot round. But I'm off topic so I'll stop now.
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There's still hope Gaijin won't make the Jagdtiger fight the T-62 or any other Cold War tank. I mean, they have been making good decisions as of late.
But anyway, if thenT-44 got that experimental (or was it rare) ammo recently, I don't see why the Jagdtiger can't get a Sabot round. But I'm off topic so I'll stop now.

With the M103 having the 380mm of HEAT, this actually seems rather reasonable (not complaining about the HEAT round of course, it is historical, although 380mm of pen is a lot to wrap your head around.)

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With the M103 having the 380mm of HEAT, this actually seems rather reasonable (not complaining about the HEAT round of course, it is historical, although 380mm of pen is a lot to wrap your head around.)

Wait untill HEAT rounds work...

 

On topic: If JGT is to face things like IS-4M, T-10M, T-62a etc. sure why not. If it is going to stay fighting '43-45 vehicles I see reason to add those rounds, evermore considering those are just standard rounds made "fit" for bigger barrels.

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Wait untill HEAT rounds work...

 

On topic: If JGT is to face things like IS-4M, T-10M, T-62a etc. sure why not. If it is going to stay fighting '43-45 vehicles I see reason to add those rounds, evermore considering those are just standard rounds made "fit" for bigger barrels.

You mean after the WIP MM system rework?

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I'm curious to see how Gaijin addresses future DMs and APDS. I've spend sometime experimenting with the APDS on the M41, and it feels very inconsistent. (Though, I'm aware that spalling is not modeled in the game, and this is different APDS.)

 

I've had pretty good results at close ranges (Poland < 100m) and long ranges ~900m +. However, it's OHK are quite random in intermediate ranges, even when I pen the ammo stack. At the moment, APCR produces much more consistent results.

Edited by NotPinkiePie
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I'm curious to see how Gaijin addresses future DMs and APDS. I've spend sometime experimenting with the APDS on the M41, and it feels very inconsistent. (Though, I'm aware that spalling is not modeled in the game, and this is different APDS.)
 
I've had pretty good results at close ranges (Poland < 100m) and long ranges ~900m +. However, it's OHK are quite random in intermediate ranges, even when I pen the ammo stack. At the moment, APCR produces much more consistent results.

Well, according to BVV on the RU Q/A, spalling is actually being finalized right now and going to be released very soon. Damage wise, they'll prob be more lethal the larger and faster they are as opposed to cavity shells with explosive filler. But yea, I'm hoping spalling gets implemented this week. Once again though, this is off topic as OP is requesting data.
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There's still hope Gaijin won't make the Jagdtiger fight the T-62 or any other Cold War tank. I mean, they have been making good decisions as of late.
But anyway, if thenT-44 got that experimental (or was it rare) ammo recently, I don't see why the Jagdtiger can't get a Sabot round. But I'm off topic so I'll stop now.

 

T-44's ammo was not rare, it just never used that ammo.

 

The BR-367 was made for the T-34 mod. 1960, and the BR-367P APCR for the mod. 1960, lol Soviets even had 85mm APDS for the T-34 mod. 1969.

 

And my concern is that not the T-62, but the T-54A, T-54B, T-55.

 

Those had APDS IRL, and had about the same pen as the L7 APDS, so....

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Do we really want experimental, scarcely used test ammunition?

Becouse compared to this, even post war ammo has more sense to me.

And what is 'T32'? Was KV-2 ever used as 'tank'? Did T-44 ever see action in combat? Shall I start talking about all the other cases of science fiction in this game (including Panther F, i.e. II, but especially all the possible Yaks, I-301s, KP-55s etc., etc., etc.)...?

 

If US and Soviet tanks are 'permitted' to use post-WWII-ammo (usually based on German designs) to fight WWII-German tanks, where should be a problem to add experimental German ammo _from the times of WWII_?

 

Except, of course, that the game is run by a company so much reknowned for opportunism, bias, chauvinism, and nerfing own designs for satisfaction of paying customers, that it's 1000% incapable to do anything of this kind... 

Edited by xx_CoolHand_xx
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snip

yes thanks :salute:   I forgot those :facepalm:

found them in Geschoss Ringbuch Band II

those rounds where made before  June1943 acording to the book

so no late war experiments lel

 

here for u guys the dokument http://www.file-upload.net/download-10208762/geschossringbuch.pdf.html

 

Edit: Did u guys know that the standard ammo we have on the 105mm KT had an he filling of 250g :crazy:

Edited by JG27_Iluminas
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yes thanks :salute:   I forgot those :facepalm:

found them in Geschoss Ringbuch Band II

those rounds where made before  June1943 acording to the book

so no late war experiments lel

 

here for u guys the dokument http://www.file-upload.net/download-10208762/geschossringbuch.pdf.html

 

Edit: Did u guys know that the standard ammo we have on the 105mm KT had an he filling of 250g :crazy:

 

i do now

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Well, according to BVV on the RU Q/A, spalling is actually being finalized right now and going to be released very soon. Damage wise, they'll prob be more lethal the larger and faster they are as opposed to cavity shells with explosive filler. But yea, I'm hoping spalling gets implemented this week. Once again though, this is off topic as OP is requesting data.

 

It is? got a link to it)

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So looked through ze internetz and found out that the 105mm Pzgr 39(TS) was used on this fine pice of work

Bundesarchiv_Bild_101I-031-2415-16,_Russ

 

an artillerie haubitze

not cofirmed pen value of 91mm @ 500m at 30°    765 mV

from this site

http://amizaur.prv.pl/www.wargamer.org/GvA/weapons/german_guns8.html  

 

but it looks like they share the same case lenght (not sure thought)

so it would be no problem to fire it with KwK46 ore Stuh 42

 same would apply to 150mm Pzgr 39 (TS)

for Brumbär ore Hummel ore if the Maus would have got its 150mm gun that it was planed first with

 

 

Edit: also germany made test with HEDS for AA work

Edited by JG27_Iluminas
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