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why is not balance in HB?


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#1 MadderThanMaX

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 03:18 AM

one P-51 + many low ranks vs squadron of 3 FW 190 D-13??? is this fair?

Corsair 1d as top US plane in battle vs Bf 109 G-6 as top german plane? is this fair?

why is 90% HB unbalanced? how can i make some lions when income is nerfed and i have minimum chance to win?


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#2 wotertool

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 03:27 AM

Don't forget the F4Us in the german low level matches!!!

 

 

there is only 1 P51 because the others know that it will die since Germany's best fighters have a higher tier, and most players prefer those fighters to the He-112 which already faces F4Us.


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#3 vonluckner

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 08:15 AM

Because German players have figured out that they can fly whatever tier they like and still get matches against a mixed bag of lower tier American aircraft.


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#4 Karaya_one

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 12:38 PM

P51D vs D13/G6 is fair. Brush up on your history?

 

Speaking of which, Corsair 1D was also during the same timeframe as the D13/D12/G6. Hence, fair.


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#5 vonluckner

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 12:51 PM

P51D vs D13/G6 is fair. Brush up on your history?

 

Speaking of which, Corsair 1D was also during the same timeframe as the D13/D12/G6. Hence, fair.

 

Yeah, I'm sure there are similar numbers of P-51s to D-13s in the queue right now.

 

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#6 Jelhi

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 12:58 PM

Because more people are playing Germans than Americans, mostly 109s and 190s. The other day I was waiting for a match an there were 3 Americans in tiers 6-7 and over 30 Germans... Tiers 6-7 being the E3s and F4s which are VERY common in HB right now.

 

Edit: Actually, I posted the screenshot here: http://forum.warthun...on-of-the-109s/


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#7 graysson

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 03:03 PM

Dont forget that Doras are matched against Sabres not P-51D's.

P-51D's ill get when im in my Fw 190 A-5.

 

So you have 2 choices: wait 10 min and get a time out error or play against 3-6 Sabre's in squads.

 

The only chance to fly a Dora is when there arent enough players so it gets into lower tier games.

 

The problem is the lack of US planes after tier 13.

But the one suffering from it is Germany and not the US.

 

And the reason why you see more german planes in HB is because german planes arent that good in arcarde since they are all B&Z-planes.


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#8 Stona

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 04:28 PM

Because more people are playing Germans than Americans.

 

 

This, and only this.


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#9 the_Coward

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 05:29 PM

Yesterday i've shot down Fw190 D13, flying F2A-3 (i know its OP, but it was my highest tier plane) so actually muricans cant cry, because they have always plenty of buffalos.

 

But its always hater feature to cry when they have not advatnage in everything. It would be best if they have 25 planes against 5 enemies (oh wait... i was fighting 4 Bf109's with my F2A, so i run away to airfield, and they lost 3, i chased down 4th and killed him... it may be not enough advantage, so maybe 27 v 3? with tier advantage assured?)


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#10 lipsztyk

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 05:53 PM

i was flying P-51D on Hb and its not so easy to use it against german because all of them (including F-4) climbs better than P-51 so as EF, you are almost all the time in situation when you heave to wait with going to fight, while your team is alredy atacked by german planes, or go to fight and expect to be atacked by plane with more energy than you.


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#11 vonluckner

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 11:17 PM

Dont forget that Doras are matched against Sabres not P-51D's.

P-51D's ill get when im in my Fw 190 A-5.

 

So you have 2 choices: wait 10 min and get a time out error or play against 3-6 Sabre's in squads.

 

The only chance to fly a Dora is when there arent enough players so it gets into lower tier games.

 

The problem is the lack of US planes after tier 13.

But the one suffering from it is Germany and not the US.

 

And the reason why you see more german planes in HB is because german planes arent that good in arcarde since they are all B&Z-planes.

 

Please. Stop being dramatic. You don't wait 10 minutes in a Dora, and it's rare you encounter Sabres. When you do see like 10 people at Tier 20 of the opposing faction, maybe it's time to take a break for a little bit hmm.

 

If you think Germany was the one suffering, you are an idiot, period. When you queued up with a Dora in HB, you most often ended up fighting a mixed group of American aircraft that were in the Tier 4 to Tier 9 range, and then maybe 1-2 higher tier Corsairs or P-51s.

 

Typical HB as American, without being dramatic about Jets (that American players also encounter):

 

ojft7c.jpg


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#12 Spanisharmada

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 11:31 PM

I can't even play German or US on HB... only Russia and Japanese. Help?


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#13 wotertool

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 11:55 PM

ojft7c.jpg

Are that 11k km or feet?

 

 

I can't even play German or US on HB... only Russia and Japanese. Help?

Because they changed it today - after felt 400 days, finally they changed it!


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#14 graysson

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 12:12 AM

Please. Stop being dramatic. You don't wait 10 minutes in a Dora, and it's rare you encounter Sabres. When you do see like 10 people at Tier 20 of the opposing faction, maybe it's time to take a break for a little bit hmm.

 

If you think Germany was the one suffering, you are an idiot, period. When you queued up with a Dora in HB, you most often ended up fighting a mixed group of American aircraft that were in the Tier 4 to Tier 9 range, and then maybe 1-2 higher tier Corsairs or P-51s.

 

Typical HB as American, without being dramatic about Jets (that American players also encounter):

 

Did you even fly the Doras? I flew both sides and had no real problems on US-side since it has so much good planes below tier 7.

One time i even got 2 kills and a assist in my B-25 lying on the ground without wings and tail.

 

Here was my experience:

 

1. try: 6 Sabres

2. try: 3 Sabres

3. try: timeout after 10min

4. try: another timeout

 

After that i gave up flying the Dora and flew other planes.

 

The Fw 190 A-5 i could only fly once every 2 days because the repair costs are even higher than the P-51D and not even close to the earnings.

 

The MM with my Bf 109's was ok with a quadcannon Corsair or a P-51D sometimes.

 

In low tier it got insane again.

Kittyhawks, Buffalos, Wildcats, A-20G's against...nothing.

He 112's or Folgores arent even close to a match.

The moment you try the tier 6 Bf 109 (the first german plane that somewhat good) you get into tier 7-9 games where youre plane isnt a match anymore.

 

 

But it seems these problems arent anything against the new map.

In a tier 2 Ki-43 you see Migs.


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#15 vonluckner

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 12:41 AM

Did you even fly the Doras? I flew both sides and had no real problems on US-side since it has so much good planes below tier 7.

One time i even got 2 kills and a assist in my B-25 lying on the ground without wings and tail.

 

Here was my experience:

 

1. try: 6 Sabres

2. try: 3 Sabres

3. try: timeout after 10min

4. try: another timeout

 

After that i gave up flying the Dora and flew other planes.

 

The Fw 190 A-5 i could only fly once every 2 days because the repair costs are even higher than the P-51D and not even close to the earnings.

 

The MM with my Bf 109's was ok with a quadcannon Corsair or a P-51D sometimes.

 

In low tier it got insane again.

Kittyhawks, Buffalos, Wildcats, A-20G's against...nothing.

He 112's or Folgores arent even close to a match.

The moment you try the tier 6 Bf 109 (the first german plane that somewhat good) you get into tier 7-9 games where youre plane isnt a match anymore.

 

 

But it seems these problems arent anything against the new map.

In a tier 2 Ki-43 you see Migs.

 

Yes, I flew both German and American. Dora queue times were 2-4 minutes for me, although I alt-tabbed while waiting in queue so I'm not sure exactly how long. It certainly wasn't 10 minutes, and I never had one time out on me.

 

Obviously Germany has problems at low tiers, but the solution to that isn't allowing German high-tier aircraft to fight low-tier American aircraft. The solution is to fix German low tier aircraft and get rid of this xxxx matchmaking that puts Sabres against Bf.109s or Doras against P-40s in the first place!

 

 

 

Are that 11k km or feet?

 

 

Feet


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#16 Darkhart

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 01:18 AM

The HB matchmaking is insane

I play rank 4-5

I kept getting put up against p-51, p-63 and f-86

how is a he-111 or ju-88 supposed to match against those?

how is it 'Historic' to have this disparity of plane types?

I could see there were 20+ planes waiting in the 0-1 and 2-3 tiers on each side

yet I was dropped in a game against a sabre, with 3 reserves on my team, and three ai on each team

why were there ai where there were that many players waiting?

why did an f-86 get dropped in a game with reserve planes?

 

I have just stopped playing HB of any kind because of this

also

every single sabre was being flown by someone from the ACES clan

every

single

time

 

what kind of matchmaking algorithm is putting these matches together?


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#17 Oy_Vey_Goyjin

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 01:52 AM

Thats because MM for HB should be based off of year of service and NOT this ridiculous tier bullshit.


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#18 graysson

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 02:15 AM

Yes, I flew both German and American. Dora queue times were 2-4 minutes for me, although I alt-tabbed while waiting in queue so I'm not sure exactly how long. It certainly wasn't 10 minutes, and I never had one time out on me.

 

Obviously Germany has problems at low tiers, but the solution to that isn't allowing German high-tier aircraft to fight low-tier American aircraft. The solution is to fix German low tier aircraft and get rid of this xxxx matchmaking that puts Sabres against Bf.109s or Doras against P-40s in the first place!

 

Youre right...but with the last US-fighter at tier 13 what do you think should MM be for the Sabres?

What should they be matched against?

Because they did get matched against against the next lower tier...the tier 14 Dora.


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#19 vonluckner

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 03:03 AM

Youre right...but with the last US-fighter at tier 13 what do you think should MM be for the Sabres?

What should they be matched against?

Because they did get matched against against the next lower tier...the tier 14 Dora.

 

I don't think they should be getting into matches at all unless the Germans can match them with, at the very least, an equal number of 262s. The same goes for D-13s and G-6s vs. P-51s and F4U-1cs. The same goes for F2A-1s vs. He 112s.

 

The tiers will never be balanced, and while the devs should do their best to balance them, players should also accept some responsibility for compromising to make fun and fair games, rather than abusing the matchmaking to fight lower tier aircraft.


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#20 graysson

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 03:31 AM

I don't think they should be getting into matches at all unless the Germans can match them with, at the very least, an equal number of 262s. The same goes for D-13s and G-6s vs. P-51s and F4U-1cs. The same goes for F2A-1s vs. He 112s.

 

The tiers will never be balanced, and while the devs should do their best to balance them, players should also accept some responsibility for compromising to make fun and fair games, rather than abusing the matchmaking to fight lower tier aircraft.

 

I think the difference between a Kittyhawk or Corsair is alot lower than between the Dora and the Sabre.

Even Me 262's arent a match for a second generation jet like the Sabre.

Especially since the Me 262 is more of an attacker and the Sabre a fighter.

 

The only plane the could compete (at least in arcarde) was the Me 163 which took a big nerf by limiting the fuel in all game modes.

They dont even give it real climb rate of 160m/s.

And then they wonder why the russian bias thing comes always up again.

 

Compare the repair costs of japanese planes with russian planes.

A Ki-61 Ib (comparable to the second Buffalo or first Wildcat) cost 6k to repair while a Yak-9T costs 3.5k.

The Yak-3 costs 4k and a Lagg-3 (comparable to the Ki-61) costs only 600 lions to repair.

 

And thats only the facts that doesnt count how the russian planes fly or how durable they are.


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